How to calculate percentage of water vapour that condenses?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating the percentage of water vapor that condenses when moist air is cooled from 21°C to 5°C at a constant pressure of 1 bar. Participants explore the relationships between relative humidity, vapor pressure, and the properties of moist air, including mass and mole fractions.

Discussion Character

  • Homework-related
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Technical explanation
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents a calculation for the percentage of water vapor that condenses based on relative humidity before and after cooling, suggesting a decrease of 65.2%.
  • Another participant questions the interpretation of vapor pressure as saturation vapor pressure and asks for the partial pressure of water vapor, mole fractions, and mass fractions in the moist air.
  • Several participants calculate the mass and mole fractions of water vapor and dry air, using the humidity ratio and ideal gas principles, but express uncertainty about the effects of cooling and dehumidification on these values.
  • One participant calculates the amount of water that condenses, arriving at a conclusion of 50.5% condensation based on the difference in water vapor before and after cooling.
  • Another participant acknowledges an oversight regarding the relationship between vapor pressure and saturation pressure in their calculations.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various approaches to the problem, with some calculations leading to different percentages of condensation. There is no consensus on the correct method or final answer, and multiple competing views remain regarding the calculations and interpretations of the data.

Contextual Notes

Some calculations depend on assumptions about the ideal gas behavior and the definitions of vapor pressure and saturation pressure. The discussion includes unresolved mathematical steps and varying interpretations of the relationships between the variables involved.

Rhaegal

Homework Statement


1kg of moist air of RH 70% at 21oC is cooled at a constant pressure of 1 bar to 5oC. The vapour pressure at 21oC and 5oC are 0.025 bar and 0.0087 bar. The percentage of water vapour that condenses into water at 5oC is?

Want to check whether my intuition & logic are correct.

Homework Equations


RH = Vapour Pressure/ Saturation Pressure

The Attempt at a Solution


Before cooling, Saturation pressure = 0.025/0.7 = 1/28 bar

As cooling & dehumidification occurs at constant pressure, Saturation pressure before cooling = saturation pressure after cooling.
RH after cooling = 0.0087 * 28 = 0.2436

% decrease of RH = ((0.7-0.2436)*100)/0.7 = 65.2 %
which equals percentage of water vapour that condenses into water.

Am I missing anything here? Because I cannot find any text to support this type of calculation.
Thanks in advance!
 
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When they say that the vapor pressure at 21 C is 0.025 bars, what they mean is that this is the saturation vapor pressure at 21 C. This being the case, in the 1 kg of moist air under consideration, what is the partial pressure of water vapor at 21 C? What is the mole fraction of water vapor and what is the mole fraction of air? What is the mass fraction of water vapor and the mass fraction of air? How many kg of dry air are the in 1 kg of the moist air? How many kg or water are in the 1 kg of moist air?
 
Chestermiller said:
When they say that the vapor pressure at 21 C is 0.025 bars, what they mean is that this is the saturation vapor pressure at 21 C. This being the case, in the 1 kg of moist air under consideration, what is the partial pressure of water vapor at 21 C? What is the mole fraction of water vapor and what is the mole fraction of air? What is the mass fraction of water vapor and the mass fraction of air? How many kg of dry air are the in 1 kg of the moist air? How many kg or water are in the 1 kg of moist air?
So Humidity ratio = 0.622Pv/(Pa - Pv) = mv / ma
From this, mass of dry air ma = 0.9890 kg & mass of water vapor mv = 0.011 kg
Mass fraction of water vapor = 11/1000 & Mass fraction of dry air = 989/1000
Mole fraction of dry air = 0.9824 & Mole fraction of water vapor = 0.0176
I do not know what effect cooling & dehumidification has on these values. I feel I have to use the ideal gas equation but am confused about the P,V values for both the states.
 
Rhaegal said:
So Humidity ratio = 0.622Pv/(Pa - Pv) = mv / ma
From this, mass of dry air ma = 0.9890 kg & mass of water vapor mv = 0.011 kg
Mass fraction of water vapor = 11/1000 & Mass fraction of dry air = 989/1000
Mole fraction of dry air = 0.9824 & Mole fraction of water vapor = 0.0176
I do not know what effect cooling & dehumidification has on these values. I feel I have to use the ideal gas equation but am confused about the P,V values for both the states.
The amount of dry air in the cooled air would not change, and would still be 989.1 g, which is 989.1/29=34.11 moles. In the final air at 5 C, the partial pressure of water vapor in this air would be 0.0087 bars, and the mole fraction water vapor would be 0.0087. So the mole fraction of the dry air is 1-0.0087=0.9913. So the total number of moles of gas in the final sample would be 34.11/0.9913=34.41 moles. So the number of moles of water vapor would be (34.41)(0.0087)
=0.299 moles of water. The mass of this number of moles of water is (0.299)(18)=5.39 gm.

So, the amount of water that condenses from the moist air = 10.9 - 5.4 = 5.5 gm. So the fraction of water that condenses is 5.5/10.9=0.505 = 50.5%
 
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Chestermiller said:
The amount of dry air in the cooled air would not change, and would still be 989.1 g, which is 989.1/29=34.11 moles. In the final air at 5 C, the partial pressure of water vapor in this air would be 0.0087 bars, and the mole fraction water vapor would be 0.0087. So the mole fraction of the dry air is 1-0.0087=0.9913. So the total number of moles of gas in the final sample would be 34.11/0.9913=34.41 moles. So the number of moles of water vapor would be (34.41)(0.0087)
=0.299 moles of water. The mass of this number of moles of water is (0.299)(18)=5.39 gm.

So, the amount of water that condenses from the moist air = 10.9 - 5.4 = 5.5 gm. So the fraction of water that condenses is 5.5/10.9=0.505 = 50.5%
I overlooked the fact that at the final state, vapor pressure is equal to saturation pressure. Thanks for helping me approach the problem correctly
 

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