In the derivation of a cycloid - problem in Stewart

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the properties of the arc PT and the line segment OT in the context of the cycloid derivation presented in Stewart's textbook. Participants explore the concepts of homeomorphism and isomorphism, particularly in relation to curves and their mathematical definitions.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether the arc PT and the line segment OT are homeomorphisms, suggesting they might be.
  • Another participant asserts that they are isomorphic, stating that both are curves.
  • A different participant cautions that the term "isomorphic" needs clarification, noting that while they may be isomorphic as sets, not all curves are isomorphic in all categories.
  • One participant argues that arc PT and line segment OT cannot be homeomorphisms since homeomorphisms are functions, not merely sets of points, but acknowledges that they are homeomorphic.
  • This same participant also emphasizes that isomorphism pertains to relationships between algebraic structures, which may not apply without operations on the set.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the definitions and applicability of homeomorphism and isomorphism, indicating a lack of consensus on these terms in the context of the discussion.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved nuances regarding the definitions of homeomorphism and isomorphism, as well as the conditions under which these concepts apply to the curves in question.

tronter
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In the derivation of a cycloid, it says (pg. 655 Stewart, 5th ed) [tex]|OT| = \text{arc} \ PT = r \theta[/tex].

I was just wondering if if this implies that [tex]\text{arc}\ PT[/tex] and the line segment [tex]OT[/tex] are homeomorphisms?

When I first learned about cycloids, I didn't know that homeomorphisms were. But now, having learned about them, it seems that they are in fact homeomorphisms.
 
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i would go even further and say they are isomorphic, they're both just curves
 
Careful - you've not said what you mean by isomorphic. Sure, as sets they are, as topological spaces, but not all curves are isomorphic in all categories (eg, rational curves with rational maps).
 
I would say you need to be more careful with your use of words! No, arc PT and line segment OT are not homeomorphisms because hemeomorphisms are functions, not sets of points. It is true, of course, that they are homeomorphic.

My understanding of "isomorphism" is that it is a relationship between algebraic structures. In you do not have operations on the set, then "isomorphic" does not apply.
 
I would say you need to be more careful with your use of words! No, arc PT and line segment OT are not homeomorphisms because hemeomorphisms are functions, not sets of points. It is true, of course, that they are homeomorphic.

My understanding of "isomorphism" is that it is a relationship between algebraic structures. In you do not have operations on the set, then "isomorphic" does not apply.
 

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