News Is Fox News Fair and Balanced ? (different than last poll!)

Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced?"

  • Balanced, and I watch Fox News regularly (daily or weekly)

    Votes: 4 11.1%
  • Balanced, and I watch Fox News irregularly (a few times a month)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Balanced, and I watch Fox News rarely (yearly or less)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Unbalanced but similar to other news programs, and I watch Fox News regularly (daily or weekly)

    Votes: 4 11.1%
  • Unbalanced but similar to other news programs, and I watch Fox News irregularly (...month...)

    Votes: 2 5.6%
  • Unbalanced but similar to other news programs, and I watch Fox News rarely (yearly or less)

    Votes: 7 19.4%
  • Unbalanced unlike most news programs, and I watch Fox News regularly (daily or weekly)

    Votes: 1 2.8%
  • Unbalanced unlike most news programs, and I watch Fox News irregularly (a few times a month)

    Votes: 6 16.7%
  • Unbalanced unlike most news programs, and I watch Fox News rarely (yearly or less)

    Votes: 9 25.0%
  • No opinion, and I watch Fox News regularly (daily or weekly)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • No opinion, and I watch Fox News irregularly (a few times a month)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • No opinion, and I watch Fox News rarely (yearly or less)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Decline to answer/don't understand

    Votes: 3 8.3%

  • Total voters
    36
  • Poll closed .
1,740
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Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

I never realized how biased the US mainstream media was until I watched the invasion of Baghdad on both US and Mexican news broadcasts. All the American reporters were embedded with the troops and their reports mirrored the point of view of the US military.

The Mexican reporters also reported the US's point of view but in addition showed the destruction of the city while it was being destroyed and interviewed people on the street who had lost family or had been seriously injured.

It was clear the military had learned its lesson from the Vietnam war how objective reporting can turn public opinion against the war.
 
A

Al68

Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

Am I the only one who finds it ironic that after decades of leftist propaganda passing itself off as news completely unchecked, now that it's only most networks, instead of all networks, with "strong left-wing bias", there's an uproar? That's both hilarious and disturbing at the same time.
 
A

Al68

Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

I never realized how biased the US mainstream media was until I watched the invasion of Baghdad on both US and Mexican news broadcasts. All the American reporters were embedded with the troops and their reports mirrored the point of view of the US military.

The Mexican reporters also reported the US's point of view but in addition showed the destruction of the city while it was being destroyed and interviewed people on the street who had lost family or had been seriously injured.
Uh, U.S. media outlets did that, too. But how is interviewing friends and family of injured/killed an "opposing point of view"? Were there opposing points of view regarding the fact that people were injured/killed, or that they had friends/family? Or that the friends/family didn't like them being injured/killed? That makes no sense.

And you don't seriously expect the U.S. military itself to not have a pro-U.S. military bias, do you?
 
107
0
Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

I never realized how biased the US mainstream media was until I watched the invasion of Baghdad on both US and Mexican news broadcasts. All the American reporters were embedded with the troops and their reports mirrored the point of view of the US military.

The Mexican reporters also reported the US's point of view but in addition showed the destruction of the city while it was being destroyed and interviewed people on the street who had lost family or had been seriously injured.

It was clear the military had learned its lesson from the Vietnam war how objective reporting can turn public opinion against the war.
Just out of curiosity, how do those Mexican news organizations report on violence in the streets of Mexico - and along the US border?:grumpy:
 
1,740
48
Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

Al68, perhaps I'm wrong but I don't remember seeing any US reporters in Baghdad during the bombing. There were reporters from other countries there.

The US reporting was very sanitized showing the war more as a video game than war. I meant to contrast that with the Mexican reporting that showed the horrors of war. Of course I expect the US military to have a pro-US bias and so must have all the embedded reporters which is my point that the reporting was very biased.

WhoWee, Mexican news is very good about everything except the Mexican government. Reporting about street violence and drug wars is another matter. They did used to report those things but after many, many reporters were killed for reporting drug violence, the reporting has be cut way back.
 

russ_watters

Mentor
18,508
4,724
Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

If there is a doubt whether a news organization is fair and balanced then it has already lost its credibility.
I don't consider any news organization to be fair and balanced, but that doesn't have all that much to do with their credibility (or lack thereof).
Oddly for all its touting itself as fair and balanced (perhaps necessary in order to preserve some credibility) Fox News appealed and won the case of Steve Wilson & Jane Akre who were fired for refusing to broadcast a false version of their report on bovine growth hormone in milk, thus winning the right to broadcast lies. How much further from fair and balanced can you get? Is their audience made up primarily of people who watch because Fox News presents the news they want to hear instead of the truth?
Losing the case means the jury believed their claims were false. The portion that was appealed was the whistleblower protection, which they initially won because they (the reporters) believed Fox violated a law, which would get them protection whether they were right or not. On appeal, it was decided that the reporters were citing a law that didn't apply and thus had nothing on which to base a whislteblower lawsuit. But that judgement did not address the meat of the reporters' claim as to whether Fox actually did order them to falsify a report. It only decided that whether Fox did or not was irrelevant to the fact that the case had no merrit. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jane_Akre

Beyond that, the idea that a news outlet can't report lies if it wants seems like an obvious violation of the First Amendment to me. It's really too bad no one has directly challenged the FCC on that, but perhaps this ruling was an end-around that issue.
 
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173
0
Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

I think it's hilarious that those who are most apt to say Fox news is unbalanced are those who rarely, if ever, watch it.

I selected "Unbalanced but similar to other news programs, and I watch Fox News regularly (daily or weekly)."

No news program is entirely balanced. Furthermore, I would submit that when news agencies try to be balanced, they usually go overboard, or go about it the wrong way, such as with "equal time" or "equal space" on the issues, even when the split on the issue might be 90%/10% among the general populace. That approach itself is biased.
 

Hepth

Gold Member
437
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Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

I just noticed this today, there was an AP article about global warming that was repeated in many places:
http://www.cbc.ca/technology/story/2010/11/30/tech-cancun-un-climate.html
http://hosted2.ap.org/COGRA/f29d8dad34bd498da777a4fb9802979d/Article_2010-11-30-LT-Climate-Conference/id-d0c127e2c011458e8487634f2c362cb4
http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2010/11/30/climate-change-scorching-heat-weather-agency/#content

as well as others.

Now I read through some of them, and they all appear almost word for word the same EXCEPT Fox News's version. They change words, and add some stuff:

I.E.
AP :
Scientists say the warming trend is caused mainly by industrial pollution accumulating in the atmosphere and trapping heat. Negotiations conducted under UN auspices have been trying to find ways to reduce greenhouse gas emissions to keep temperatures from rising to levels likely to have disastrous consequences.
Fox:
Some scientists say the warming trend is caused mainly by industrial pollution accumulating in the atmosphere and trapping heat. Negotiations conducted under U.N. auspices have been trying to find ways to reduce greenhouse gas emissions to keep temperatures from rising to levels likely to have disastrous consequences.

Then immediately after:
Fox:
Others argue that the connection between carbon emissions and climate change remains unproven -- and that until the science is settled, public policy and the literally billions of dollars at stake should not be spent.

Which wasn't in the original article.

Several parts of the world experienced freakish or extreme weather this year, the WMO said.

From AP, becomes from Fox:
This year witnessed freakish weather, both heat and extreme cold, the WMO said.

"government planners should prepare for a warming world."
From AP, becomes from Fox:
"government planners should plan for a warming world."


I know it's small changes, but that's all it really takes to change some of the ideas of the original article. Is this common practice?
 
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mheslep

Gold Member
255
727
Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

I know it's small changes, but that's all it really takes to change some of the ideas of the original article. Is this common practice?
You are assuming the AP article is some kind of ground truth? Why? FN, and most news outlets I assume, acknowledge the wire services as a source, that doesn't mean the AP is the only source.

For one of those cases:

AP:
Scientists say
Fox:
Some scientists say

which is more precise, simply as matter of English usage? The former leaves open the idea that the AP knows the opinion of all scientists, an impossible pretense.
 
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jeffray

Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

I think it's hilarious that those who are most apt to say Fox news is unbalanced are those who rarely, if ever, watch it.
How is that "hilarious?" When I (rarely) watch Fox News, I always notice the same, obvious conservative bias. Why would I waste my time tuning in anymore? You say that as if everyone in this category has never watched Fox one time and is simply basing their opinions on preconceived ideas of whether Fox is fair or not.
 

Hepth

Gold Member
437
39
Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

To mheslep:

No i mean, is it common practice to take an article nearly verbatim, but make small slight changes. I don't think the AP article is COMPETE or CORRECT, but all that means is that if Fox didn't agree with what they wrote shouldn't they have just written their own article?

It seems weird to modify something like this while still attributing it to the original distributor, I guess is my point. If it had said :Associated Press, Edited by Fox News. Then I'd think "Oh ok, they felt some things were left out and added them."
But, to be honest, I read the article first on Fox News and I felt surprised an AP article would say things like the "Others argue" paragraph. So I looked for the article elsewhere and noticed these changes.

Isn't that something like plagiarism? But not really. I don't know the term for it. Its as if I completely copied The Lord of The Rings, but changed "Frodo" to "Prodo", and still claimed it was by Tolkien.
 
2,400
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Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

Why do you fail to realize that this is part of an agenda ? In particular, there is a very important addition :
"Others argue that [...] billions of dollars at stake should not be spent."
It would be quite a position for "scientists" to take. It is not a scientific statement, but a political proposal. Fox News has the pretense to re-define what science does ?

Your own National Academy of Science in their 2010 proceedings states :
"97–98% of the climate researchers most actively publishing in the field support the tenets of ACC (Anthropogenic Climate Change) outlined by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change"
This is quite a level of agreement amongst scientist. Maybe Fox News should make it more precise by saying that the minority of less than 3% of scientists still in doubt has a "relative climate expertise and scientific prominence [...] substantially below that of the convinced researchers" (still your Academy) ?
 

Dembadon

Gold Member
607
89
Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

I think it's hilarious that those who are most apt to say Fox news is unbalanced are those who rarely, if ever, watch it.

...
Have the programs changed significantly in the past month? How often does one need to "check-in" in order to make an accurate assessment?
 

Hepth

Gold Member
437
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Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

"News" is packaged and re-packaged every day.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/News_agency
Ok, that makes sense then. I figured as much but wasn't sure on how widely this was known.

So from a Conservative standpoint, are there any "News Sources (AP, Reuters, Etc)" that Fox News should be able to pull from, and like the "left" media, use without editing in such a way? I ask this because the other news organizations did not modify AP's original cable, only Fox had. I assume this will be argued as because AP is a liberal news agency or something and so CBC and others don't have to modify it; which is fine. But there seems to be a problem if there is no one else to "Trust".

EDIT: And for clarification, every time I mention Fox News, I'm really talking about their internet news rather than their TV station. At least in MY posts. I can't stand the TV channel, as I despise ANY opinion show or column. They just make me angry.
 

mheslep

Gold Member
255
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Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

To mheslep:

No i mean, is it common practice to take an article nearly verbatim, but make small slight changes. ...
From the wire services yes, and not just slight, except for quoted material. Here's the same story from Time.
Time/AP said:
The brutal heat waves that killed thousands of Europeans in 2003 and that choked Russia earlier this year will seem like average summers in the future as the Earth continues to warm, the U.N. weather agency said Tuesday.
... ...
and then they felt the need to insert this paragraph from noted climate expert Hugo Chavez.
Time/AP said:
In Venezuela, President Hugo Chávez called recent extreme weather swings there an example of climate change. The country suffered a severe drought early this year, and now is in the midst of deadly floods occurring past the traditional end of the rainy season.
"These are the big climate changes, the big disturbances that make the dry seasons, the wet seasons unpredictable," Chávez said Monday on state television.

... ....
The European Union said Tuesday it has mobilized euro2.2 billion ($2.9 billion ) this year, and is on track to meet its pledge of euro7.2 billion over three years in "fast track" financing. U.S. delegate Jonathan Pershing said Monday Washington has allocated $1.7 billion for 2010.
http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,2033876,00.html [Broken]
How far the once superb, colossal creation of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Luce" [Broken] has fallen.
 
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Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

Your arguments are remarkable : "others do worse, so we do not need to improve".
 

mheslep

Gold Member
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Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

Why do you fail to realize that this is part of an agenda
?
That, when read as "why don't you think as I do", or "stop questioning my position", answers itself.

humanino said:
In particular, there is a very important addition :
"Others argue that [...] billions of dollars at stake should not be spent."
It would be quite a position for "scientists" to take. It is not a scientific statement, but a political proposal. Fox News has the pretense to re-define what science does ?

Your own National Academy of Science in their 2010 proceedings states :
"97–98% of the climate researchers most actively publishing in the field support the tenets of ACC (Anthropogenic Climate Change) outlined by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change"
This is quite a level of agreement amongst scientist. Maybe Fox News should make it more precise by saying that the minority of less than 3% of scientists still in doubt has a "relative climate expertise and scientific prominence [...] substantially below that of the convinced researchers" (still your Academy) ?
Well the sentence says "Others", chasing the sentence on "Negotiations conducted under U.N. auspices". Even so, http://www.columbia.edu/~jeh1/mailings/20081229_DearMichelleAndBarack.pdf" [Broken]. And 'others' that do indeed agree with the technical tenets of the last IPCC, nonetheless take positions that spending vast sums on Cap and Trade type schemes are not worthwhile given other world problems, or unlikely to succeed in attempting to stop a 2-3 degree C rise over 100 years.
 
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mheslep

Gold Member
255
727
Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

Your arguments are remarkable : "others do worse, so we do not need to improve".
I said no such thing.
 
2,400
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Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

That, when read as "why don't you think as I do", or "stop questioning my position", answers itself.
Please forgive my insistence, but it's not me, it is your own Academy of Science on a scientific question.
http://www.columbia.edu/~jeh1/mailings/20081229_DearMichelleAndBarack.pdf" [Broken]
That is a private letter. It is quite different from a false statement on the most important network. Besides, you are doing it again anyway : "if others do it, it's fine if we do it".
 
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2,400
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Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

I said no such thing.
Yes you did, you justified Fox distortion by mentioning another distortion.
 

Hepth

Gold Member
437
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Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

I don't think he's really calling it a "distortion" but rather a "commonplace augmentation of news in effort to create a more audience-specific article" and that its not necessarily a BAD thing, but a COMMON and ACCEPTED thing; and so giving reference to another article as example should actually be expected, in order to back up his assertion.
 

CRGreathouse

Science Advisor
Homework Helper
2,818
0
Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

Your arguments are remarkable : "others do worse, so we do not need to improve".
I read his post as disagreeing with the assertion "other news organizations did not modify AP's original cable, only Fox had" (or simply stating that this does not generalize to most cases). It's not clear that there's anything wrong with modifying wire reports.
 

mheslep

Gold Member
255
727
Re: Is Fox News "Fair and Balanced"? (different than last poll!)

I read his post as disagreeing with the assertion "other news organizations did not modify AP's original cable, only Fox had" (or simply stating that this does not generalize to most cases). It's not clear that there's anything wrong with modifying wire reports.
Exactly. In addition, I grant that media sources make errors, large and small, some careless and some because of bias. That is all a different matter from how they choose to go about repackaging wire reports. My objection in this particular thread is to the suggestion that some how FN has any kind of monopoly on errors because, as far as I can tell, FN covers stories and angles that previously were willfully ignored by legacy media.
 

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