News Is Karzai insane, or does he have a trap-door?

[turbo]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/11/18/us-afghan-security-pact_n_4294976.html Karzai seems like a moron, lately. The US should cut all ties with him and wait for a new dictator to fill his shoes. Without US cash, he wouldn't last a week, IMO.

Can we please quit paying for jerks in the Middle East to hold their "offices"? When is the Dulles era of foreign policy going to wind down?

 

[Ryan_m_b]

I don't see much of a problem with his rejection of the clause that allows US troops the freedom to search an afghan house after the pull out of troops.

 

[russ_watters]

Indeed I would say that demanding sovereignty is exactly what you'd hope a President would do!

 

[turbo]

Indeed I would say that demanding sovereignty is exactly what you'd hope a President would do!

I submit that Karzai's ability to make "demands" ends as soon as his government stops demanding more and more money from the US taxpayers. Sovereignty is a condition that results from stability and self-sufficiency. Neither of those are evident in Afghanistan.

 

[phinds]

I submit that Karzai's ability to make "demands" ends as soon as his government stops demanding more and more money from the US taxpayers. Sovereignty is a condition that results from stability and self-sufficiency. Neither of those are evident in Afghanistan.

Turbo, I agree w/ everything you have said but Karzai is pretending to be a good leader and interested in his people and his country instead of his bank account which is really all he cares about. This bs is for internal consumption. He knows that the US administration knows what he is.

He'll likely be shot 5 minutes after the US isn't protecting him any longer and it couldn't happen to a nicer guy.

 

[russ_watters]

You are arguing against yourself here turbo; simultaneously deriding him for accepting our aid and now kicking us out. He's giving you what you want, so why are you complaining?

And sovereignty: yes, he may get shot when we leave, but you can't demonstrate sovereignty if someone else is propping you up, so he has to do it at some point. And if he gets shot, that's still win-win for you (we get out, he gets shot), so again, why complain?

 

[turbo]

You are arguing against yourself here turbo; simultaneously deriding him for accepting our aid and now kicking us out. He's giving you what you want, so why are you complaining?

Karzai is not just accepting our aid. He is demanding it.

He is not kicking us out, either, because that would be his death sentence. The idiots in DC need to get a reality check, and haul back the honey wagon. We don't need to support every two-bit dictator that pretends to support US interests.

 

[russ_watters]

Karzai is not just accepting our aid. He is demanding it.

Demanding it how? How does he have any power to make such demands?[/quote]

He is not kicking us out, either, because that would be his death sentence. The idiots in DC need to get a reality check, and haul back the honey wagon. We don't need to support every two-bit dictator that pretends to support US interests.

The primary aid he is getting is us propping him up militarily. Did you not see what happened with Iraq when Iraq declined to allow us special legal status? We left completely. In fact, I'm having deja vu - I think we had this exact discussion when that happened.

 

[Ryan_m_b]

Karzai is not just accepting our aid. He is demanding it.

Demanding or requesting? Given the US invasion of Iraq and all that has gone on there I don't see much of a problem with aid money.

He is not kicking us out, either, because that would be his death sentence. The idiots in DC need to get a reality check, and haul back the honey wagon. We don't need to support every two-bit dictator that pretends to support US interests.

By what measure is he a dictator given that is an elected president?

 

[AlephZero]

By what measure is he a dictator given that is an elected president?

He was appointed (not elected) as chairman of the interim administration in 2001. He was then appointed (not elected) as interim president in 2002.

But when he was finally elected and sworn in as president in 2004, the US sent along their vice president and three former presidents, so presumably they thought the right man for the job had won - notwithstanding his small majority, allegations of voting irregularities, and the curtailment of electoral campaigning for fear of insurgent activities.

Given his appointment as interim president by a loya jirga of tribal leaders, and the general cultural attitudes in the region, westerners can form their own opinions of how likely he was to actually lose the 2004 election.

 

[Bobbywhy]

Afghan demands for more US dollars are many and very large. Here’s just one example of Afghani extortion:

“The Afghan government shut the border earlier this year in a dispute over what the US military should pay for withdrawing its gear, with Kabul insisting the Americans owed up to $70 million in customs fines.”
http://www.thenews.com.pk/article-118156-US-looks-to-cut-cost-of-Afghanistan-pullout--

 

[mheslep]

...
By what measure is he a dictator given that is an elected president?

But when he was finally elected and sworn in as president in 2004, ...

It is far from clear that Karzai has ever been fairly elected to anything.
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/11/04/international/asia/04afghan.html?_r=0
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afghan_presidential_election,_2004#Controversies
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afghan_presidential_election,_2009