Is there a mathematical proof for the existence of black holes?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the existence of black holes and whether there is a mathematical proof for their existence, primarily through the lens of General Relativity and its equations. Participants explore theoretical implications, mathematical formulations, and observational evidence related to black holes.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that black holes are predicted by General Relativity, noting that the equations imply collapse under sufficient mass, barring other forces like fusion.
  • There is a suggestion that while General Relativity provides a framework, mathematics cannot definitively "prove" the existence of black holes in an empirical sense.
  • Participants reference the Schwarzschild solution as a mathematical description of black holes, indicating its relevance to Einstein's field equations.
  • One participant expresses gratitude for a shared PDF related to the solution of Einstein's field equations, although another warns that the document contains misstatements in its non-mathematical background, cautioning against its use as a reliable reference.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that General Relativity predicts black holes, but there is no consensus on the nature of mathematical proof regarding their existence. Disagreement exists about the reliability of certain references and the interpretation of mathematical implications.

Contextual Notes

Some limitations include the dependence on the interpretation of General Relativity and the assumptions made about mass and gravitational collapse. The discussion also highlights unresolved issues regarding the accuracy of external references shared among participants.

parshyaa
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Is there a mathematical proof for the existence of black hole.
 
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Black holes are predicted by General Relativity, yes.
Math can't "prove" anything actually exists.

But, gather enough mass in one place, and GR says it must collapse into a BH (assuming it's collapse is not held at bay by fusion, such as in an active star). It's pretty much that simple.

We do have observations of masses that large and larger, and we know that they must be contained in a volume of limited size (we can tell by things orbiting it). So whatever is there, pretty much has to be a BH.
 
parshyaa said:
Is there a mathematical proof for the existence of black hole.
Uh ... Einstein's General Relativity equations?
 
Is it related to the Schwarzschild solution for the einsteins field equation
 
DaveC426913 said:
Black holes are predicted by General Relativity, yes.
Math can't "prove" anything actually exists.
. From existence I mean prediction or assumption
 
parshyaa said:
Is it related to the Schwarzschild solution for the einsteins field equation

If you mean, does that solution describe a black hole, yes, it does.
 
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Thank you peterdonis
 
Thanks for every one
 
A person had posted a pdf related to the solution of efe, that was really awsom , thank u man for that wonderful pdf
 
  • #10
parshyaa said:
A person had posted a pdf related to the solution of efe

If the math in that reference is helpful to you, that's good. Please bear in mind, though, that the moderators have reviewed the reference and determined that it contains misstatements (not in the mathematical derivation, in the non-mathematical background given in the early part of the thesis) that make it unsuitable for use as a reference here. So you should be careful in what you take from the discussion in that reference (apart from the mathematical derivation given).
 
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