Is this proof (about limits) acceptable?

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    Limits Proof
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the proof of the uniqueness of limits, specifically addressing whether the argument presented by a participant is acceptable. The scope includes mathematical reasoning and conceptual clarification regarding limits in calculus.

Discussion Character

  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes that if the limit of a function exists and is equal to two different values, then those values must be equal, using the sum of limits to support their argument.
  • Another participant challenges this proof, questioning how the conclusion that a+b = 2a or a+b = 2b was reached, suggesting it relies on the assumption being proven.
  • A different participant points out that the assumption of being able to sum limits and manipulate them freely may not hold if the limits are not unique.
  • Further elaboration is provided on the properties of limits, emphasizing that the knowledge about the limits is limited to the behavior of the function as it approaches a point.
  • Participants discuss the importance of clearly defining relations in proofs to avoid confusion and misinterpretation of logical steps.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express disagreement regarding the validity of the initial proof, with some supporting the need for a more rigorous approach based on the definition of limits. The discussion remains unresolved as no consensus is reached on the acceptability of the proof.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the limitations of the initial proof, including assumptions about the manipulation of limits and the need for a clear understanding of the properties of limits when constructing arguments.

Mathoholic!
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This is not homework.
Earlier today I was trying to prove that if a limit of a certain function exists, then it's unique:

limf(x)=a \wedge limf(x)=b (as x→x0) then a=b

I began to use the sum of limits like so:

limf(x)+limf(x)=a+a → lim2f(x)=2a (as x→x0)

And the same thing for limf(x)=b results in lim2f(x)=2b.

Now, I thought that if limf(x)=a \wedge limf(x)=b, then:

lim2f(x)=a+b (as x→x0)

I concluded that a+b=2b \vee a+b=2a, which gave me a=b on both equations.

Is this proof acceptable or do I have to prove it by the definition of limit?
 
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Mathoholic! said:
Is this proof acceptable
Not acceptable: how did you conclude a+b = 2a \vee a+b = 2b? It looks like you used the very thing you were trying to prove!
 
Hum, can you explain me how is this redundant? I'm not seeing it.. '.'
I simply summed both limits.
 
Well, you assume, for example, you can sum limits, and also split them up as you choose among the addends.

Why do you believe this would be the case if the limit was a NON-unique number?

Instead, think about the following a bit, with "a" and "b" as possibly different limits.

|a-b|=|a-f(x)+f(x)-b|<=|a-f(x)|+|b-f(x)|, by the triangle inequality, valid for any and every value of "x" you might choose to consider.

Now, how can you proceed from here to conclude that the absolute value of the difference between the two fixed numbers "a" and "b" must be less than any chosen positive number you can think of?
 
Last edited:
Mathoholic! said:
Hum, can you explain me how is this redundant? I'm not seeing it.. '.'
I simply summed both limits.

You proved

lim 2f(x) = 2a
lim 2f(x) = 2b
lim 2f(x) = a+b

and now you're trying to make statements like 2a = a+b.When you're proving things like this, it might help to write things as a relation that you would normally write with a fake equality symbol, so you don't confuse yourself by expecting transitivity. i.e. write

L(f(x), a)​

for what you would normally write as

lim f(x) = a.​

So you're trying to prove

L(f(x), a) and L(f(x), b) together imply a = b​

(incidentally, this is the theorem that justifies writing lim f(x)=a. Technically you should never write that notation until you know this theorem)

and your working has shown that

L(2f(x), 2a) and L(2f(x), a+b) and L(2f(x),2b)​

e.g. by invoking the theorem

L(g(x), u) and L(h(x), v) together imply L(g(x) + h(x), u+v)​

Now, how do you plan to conclude anything from those three relations?
 
Last edited:
To expand upon Hurkyl's comment:
What do you really KNOW about the number "a" that is claimed is the limit of f as x is close enough to x0?

What you KNOW is that the absolute value of the difference, |a-f(x)| can be made as small as you wish, as long as you let x be close enough to x0.

THAT is what you know, and nothing else. So that nugget of knowledge is all you are allowed to play around with in constructing your proof.
 

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