Is Wastewater Recycling the Solution to Extreme Drought?

[JT Smith]

Is only cosmetic? In the summer heat a dirty car will reflect less heat away and get hotter thus using more fuel to cool.

I said "mostly" not "only".

Show me the fuel use data on your dirty hot car theory.

I think car washing is about 90% vanity and 10% utility. The utility part includes looking good for people you feel you must impress, like your boss or girlfriend, as well as the possibility that dirt damages the paint or maybe costs you a tiny bit more in fuel. With occasional exceptions I usually just wait for it to rain. A violent hailstorm (stones not too big) is even better as the graupel leaves a buff shine when it's done.

But whatever. If you have to spend significant extra money on gasoline or electricity to cool your hot, dirty car maybe it's worth it if the goal is to save water. Maybe you can wash your car in gasoline.

 

[russ_watters]

I think car washing is about 90% vanity and 10% utility.

While I somewhat agree, I'd like to see a study attempting to correlate car cleanliness with bathroom cleanliness. I suspect they'd find one. Also, if one isn't washing the outside, does that mean they aren't washing the inside either? I've seen some gross interiors...

From a practical standpoint, I also hate it when I happen to brush past my car and end up with a cleaner car and dirtier pants/shirt.

 

[256bits]

While it's kind of sideways to the specific question I think the best approach to minimizing car washing water is simply to not wash the car very often. It's almost entirely a cosmetic thing.

You till have to clean somewhat - leaves, bird poop, tree sap, and hornets or wasps taking up residence.
https://pestlockdown.com/how-to-eas... also recommended to,spray from 10+ feet away.

 

[256bits]

While I somewhat agree, I'd like to see a study attempting to correlate car cleanliness with bathroom cleanliness. I suspect they'd find one. Also, if one isn't washing the outside, does that mean they aren't washing the inside either? I've seen some gross interiors...

From a practical standpoint, I also hate it when I happen to brush past my car and end up with a cleaner car and dirtier pants/shirt.

When I moved from west to central N.America I definitely noticed a more dusty car.
Cleaner air out west and the car stayed shiny for days.
Maybe its the big city with its pollution. Could be that though.

 

[bob012345]

I said "mostly" not "only".

Show me the fuel use data on your dirty hot car theory.

I think car washing is about 90% vanity and 10% utility. The utility part includes looking good for people you feel you must impress, like your boss or girlfriend, as well as the possibility that dirt damages the paint or maybe costs you a tiny bit more in fuel. With occasional exceptions I usually just wait for it to rain. A violent hailstorm (stones not too big) is even better as the graupel leaves a buff shine when it's done.

But whatever. If you have to spend significant extra money on gasoline or electricity to cool your hot, dirty car maybe it's worth it if the goal is to save water. Maybe you can wash your car in gasoline.

You are correct in that I should not have said only. Sorry.

There are many sources that prove car color has an impact of interior temperature in the sun which can be attributed to the absorption and reflection coefficients. Here is some visual proof with a FLIR camera;

https://www.motor1.com/news/367916/thermal-video-black-cars-hot/

Here is more conventional data;

https://phys.org/news/2011-10-silver-white-cars-cooler.html

It stands to reason that a dirt layer will make a car darker and less reflective and thus hotter at least in principle as dirt is known to be a good absorber of heat as it lowers the albedo of the surface.https://scied.ucar.edu/activity/12101/print-all

 

[JT Smith]

So you don't have any data. That's okay. Most people on the internet don't.

Suppose you have a car with black paint. Would dirt make it better?

Why not just get a smaller car? Or sweat a little instead of turning on the A/C? My car doesn't have air conditioning. When it's super hot I open all the windows and pour a bottle of water over myself and wonder why didn't I spend that extra $800 on the A/C?

The sole focus on saving water is the crux. Is that what you really care about?

 

[russ_watters]

Alright, let's relax here. We're talking about washing cars.

 

[bob012345]

So you don't have any data. That's okay. Most people on the internet don't.

Suppose you have a car with black paint. Would dirt make it better?

Why not just get a smaller car? Or sweat a little instead of turning on the A/C? My car doesn't have air conditioning. When it's super hot I open all the windows and pour a bottle of water over myself and wonder why didn't I spend that extra $800 on the A/C?

The sole focus on saving water is the crux. Is that what you really care about?

My 'dirty car theory' is not meant as a serious scientific thesis to argue about because we are discussing this in the Lounge, which is less formal. I think there is indirect evidence to support it which I gave you but this is meant to be a lighthearted discussion about saving some water. I meant it to be fun.

I do believe a dirty black car would be slightly hotter than a shiny clean black car because I think the albedo would be less. But the difference might be small. I'd have to do a controlled experiment.

My car is already small, a Corolla. I suppose I could get a mini Cooper.

No, saving water is not what I really care about. It's just an interesting topic to discuss during the drought.

 

[JT Smith]

I apologize if I came across harsh. You can't see my face in order to tell that I'm also just having fun.

I guess my opinion is that the minimum amount of water to wash a car is essentially zero since washing a car is rarely necessary. If you take that tack then car washing is so far down the list of water consumption activities that it's not worth worrying about. Every time you flush your toilet or take a shower you render the whole car washing thing insignificant.

I'm a lightweight backpacker and I've spent many hours obsessing over grams of weight of items. Sometimes these small differences add up to significant weight. But most of the time I'm just having fun shaving toothbrush handles.

 

[Vanadium 50]

I confess that I have once or twice "washed" my car by taking it out of the garage and out into the rain. This works so long as the rain is cleaner than the car.

 

[bob012345]

I apologize if I came across harsh. You can't see my face in order to tell that I'm also just having fun.

I guess my opinion is that the minimum amount of water to wash a car is essentially zero since washing a car is rarely necessary. If you take that tack then car washing is so far down the list of water consumption activities that it's not worth worrying about. Every time you flush your toilet or take a shower you render the whole car washing thing insignificant.

I'm a lightweight backpacker and I've spent many hours obsessing over grams of weight of items. Sometimes these small differences add up to significant weight. But most of the time I'm just having fun shaving toothbrush handles.

Thanks. It's all fine. Though I have to admit when you suggested I pee on my car and wash it with gasoline I was tempted to invite you to wash your mouth out with soap like I did as mentioned in post#5... but I refrained.

You make good points about water consumption but as for flushing toilets, I take it then you don't have an outhouse in your backyard?

https://www.theguardian.com/global/...t-clean-water-waste-fertiliser-eco-revolution

But seriously, the coming trend is wastewater being recycled to clean water anyway as mentioned in post #16.

 

[JT Smith]

No, we don't have an outhouse. Is it even legal in the city?

I've been hearing about wastewater recycling for many years. People are adverse to the idea so even as the west dries up it's going to be a hard sell. Interesting times ahead for sure. Even our drought resistant plants have been having a hard time in recent years. I used to never water them but now, ironically, as the drought worsens I am forced to water them occasionally... or let them die.

 

[bob012345]

No, we don't have an outhouse. Is it even legal in the city?

I've been hearing about wastewater recycling for many years. People are adverse to the idea so even as the west dries up it's going to be a hard sell. Interesting times ahead for sure. Even our drought resistant plants have been having a hard time in recent years. I used to never water them but now, ironically, as the drought worsens I am forced to water them occasionally... or let them die.

I wasn't too serious about the outhouse. I'd probably fall in it at some point if I had one.

I don't think the public will have much choice about wastewater treatment. In Orange County Ca, it already is in use. In a sense, wastewater is already naturally recycled anyway. The artificial process is just more direct.