##L^2## - space equivalence classes and norm

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the properties and definitions of the ##L^2##-space, specifically focusing on equivalence classes of squared integrable measurable functions defined on a measure space. Participants explore the implications of the equivalence relation based on almost everywhere equality and the associated norm, examining the conditions under which these definitions hold.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant defines the ##L^2##-space as equivalence classes of squared integrable measurable functions and states the equivalence relation based on almost everywhere equality.
  • Another participant argues that the norm defined as $$\int_{\Omega} {| \, . |}^2 \, d{\mu}$$ is not a norm without taking the square root, which is necessary for satisfying certain properties.
  • It is proposed that the equivalence of functions almost everywhere implies equality of their norms, but the converse does not hold, illustrated by a counterexample involving constant functions differing in sign.
  • Participants discuss the axiom of norms that states a norm is zero if and only if the function is the zero vector, noting that functions differing on a set of measure zero can have a zero norm.
  • One participant suggests that equivalence should be defined in terms of a "semi-norm" that becomes a full norm when considering equivalence classes.
  • There is mention of the general usage of the ##\|\cdot\|_p## notation and its relation to the set of equivalence classes, indicating some technical nuances in terminology.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the definition and properties of the norm in the context of ##L^2##-space. There is no consensus on the implications of the equivalence relation and the nature of the norm, with multiple competing interpretations presented.

Contextual Notes

Some limitations in the discussion include unresolved definitions of norms and semi-norms, as well as the implications of measure theory on the equivalence of functions. The discussion reflects a range of interpretations regarding the mathematical properties of the ##L^2##-space.

cianfa72
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TL;DR
##L^2##-space as set of equivalence classes of squared integrable measurable functions
##L^2##-space is defined as equivalence classes on the set ##\mathcal L^2## of squared integrable measurable functions ##f## defined on the measure space ##(\Omega, \mathcal A, \mu)##.

The equivalence relation ##\sim## is: ##f \sim g## iff ##f=g## almost everywhere (a.e.).

Prove that the above is equivalent to ##||f|| = ||g||##. The norm ##|| \, . ||## is defined as $$\int_{\Omega} {| \, . |}^2 \, d{\mu}$$
My attempt
Consider the map ##|f| - |g|## that is measurable since ##f,g## are. ##|f| - |g| \neq 0## on a subset of the (measurable) set ##A## where ##(f - g)## is, therefore such subset (that is measurable itself) has measure 0. Hence $$\int_{\Omega} {|f| - |g|} \, d{\mu} = 0$$ i.e. by linearity $$\int_{\Omega} {|f|} \, d{\mu} = \int_{\Omega} {|g|} \, d{\mu}$$
Same argument applies to ##|f|^2 - |g|^2##.

Does the above make sense ? Thanks.
 
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cianfa72 said:
TL;DR Summary: ##L^2##-space as set of equivalence classes of squared integrable measurable functions

##L^2##-space is defined as equivalence classes on the set ##\mathcal L^2## of squared integrable measurable functions ##f## defined on the measure space ##(\Omega, \mathcal A, \mu)##.

The equivalence relation ##\sim## is: ##f \sim g## iff ##f=g## almost everywhere (a.e.).

Prove that the above is equivalent to ##||f|| = ||g||##. The norm ##|| \, . ||## is defined as $$\int_{\Omega} {| \, . |}^2 \, d{\mu}$$

This is not a norm: you need to take the square root of it for it to satisfy the property \|af\| = |a|\|f\| for constant a.

I think the equivalence that you are looking for is that f = g a.e. is equivalent to \|f - g\| = 0.

f = g almost everywhere implies \|f\| = \|g\|, but the converse does not hold: Take f = 1, g = -1 and \Omega = [0,1] for a counterexample.

One of the axioms of a norm is that \|f\| = 0 if and only if f is the zero vector; for functions under pointwise addition the zero vector is the function which is identically zero. But for the L^2 norm, a function which is different from zero on a set of measure zero - and is therefore distinct from the zero vector - will have zero norm. We fix this by working instead with equivalance classes, with functions defined to be equivalent if and only if they differ from each other by a function with zero norm, i.e. f \sim g \quad\Leftrightarrow \quad \|f - g\| = 0.
 
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pasmith said:
This is not a norm: you need to take the square root of it for it to satisfy the property \|af\| = |a|\|f\| for constant a.
Ok yes, definitely. It is actually $$\left( \int_{\Omega} {| \, . |}^2 \, d{\mu} \right)^{\frac 1 2}$$
pasmith said:
f = g almost everywhere implies \|f\| = \|g\|, but the converse does not hold: Take f = 1, g = -1 and \Omega = [0,1] for a counterexample.
Ok, yes.

pasmith said:
One of the axioms of a norm is that \|f\| = 0 if and only if f is the zero vector; for functions under pointwise addition the zero vector is the function which is identically zero. But for the L^2 norm, a function which is different from zero on a set of measure zero - and is therefore distinct from the zero vector - will have zero norm. We fix this by working instead with equivalance classes, with functions defined to be equivalent if and only if they differ from each other by a function with zero norm, i.e. f \sim g \quad\Leftrightarrow \quad \|f - g\| = 0.
Ok, in the specific case the latter equivalence boils down to ##{|f - g|}^2 \neq 0## if and only if ##f \neq g##. Therefore both hold true on the same (measurable) set ##A## with measure 0. This is true for any p-norm.
 
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pasmith said:
We fix this by working instead with equivalance classes, with functions defined to be equivalent if and only if they differ from each other by a function with zero norm, i.e. f \sim g \quad\Leftrightarrow \quad \|f - g\| = 0.
BTW, I'd say they are defined to be equivalent iff they differ each other by a function with zero "semi-norm" i.e. w.r.t. the map that will be promoted to a full norm when considering the set of equivalence classes being defined.
 
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cianfa72 said:
BTW, I'd say they are defined to be equivalent iff they differ each other by a function with zero "semi-norm" i.e. w.r.t. the map that will be promoted to a full norm when considering the set of equivalence classes being defined.

Technically yes, although in general usage one refers to \|\cdot\|_p : \mathcal{L}^p \to [0, \infty) : f \mapsto \left(\int_\Omega |f|^p\,d\mu\right)^{1/p} as a norm and writes \|f\|_p for what is technically \|[f]\|_p. It's also possible to find that both the set of functions for which \int_{\Omega} |f|^p\,d\mu exists and the set of equivalence classes of such functions are denoted by \mathcal{L}^p(\Omega).
 
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