Maximum Short Circuit Current (Fault-Current) before breakdown of cond

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on calculating the maximum short circuit current (fault current) that a bus-bar can withstand in a three-phase electrical cabinet operating at 400V/415V with a specified fault current of 46 kA for 1 second. Participants explore methods for calculating short circuit currents over different time intervals and the relationship between current and time in this context.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant seeks a method to calculate the short circuit current the bus-bar can bear and questions the relationship between current and time.
  • Another participant proposes a relationship where the product of current squared and time is a constant, inviting further explanation.
  • A third participant provides a formula for calculating peak short-circuit current and discusses the physical effects that the circuit elements must withstand, emphasizing that the maximum instantaneous value does not depend on time.
  • This participant also outlines how short-circuit current decreases over time and introduces concepts of thermal effects and rated short-time withstand current.
  • A fourth participant elaborates on the factors influencing steady state load current and short-circuit current, including transformer ratings and system impedance, providing detailed calculations for various components in the circuit.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the relationship between current and time, with some proposing specific formulas while others provide alternative perspectives on the calculations and dependencies involved. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the exact methods and relationships applicable to the scenario presented.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference specific standards (IEC 60909-1, IEC 60865-1) and provide detailed calculations that depend on various assumptions, such as neglecting resistance in certain components and the specific characteristics of the supply system. These assumptions may affect the applicability of the proposed methods.

tipu_sultan
Messages
12
Reaction score
0
Here find some attached circuit of three phase cabinet which operation voltage is 400V /415V and have operated current 800A, fault current for 1 sec is 46 KA and have incoming and outgoing links with one phase Lighting and socket.

I want to know is there some method that one can calculate the short circuit current per second that the bus-bar can bear.

Moreover I also want to calculate the short circuit current for 3 second.

Is there any relation between the current and time in this case (directly, or Inversely Proportion) ?

Please provide me the formula if exist to calculate short circuit current (fault-current) in any time.
 

Attachments

  • Short-Curcuit-Current-1sec.jpg
    Short-Curcuit-Current-1sec.jpg
    32.9 KB · Views: 1,234
Engineering news on Phys.org
Is there any relation between the current and time in this case (directly, or Inversely Proportion) ?


Product of I2 X t = constant

think about that... can you explain why?
 
The short-circuit current presents different values significant for withstand calculation:
ip[peak value] =k*sqrt(2)*I”k [IEC 60909-1 definition]
k=1.7-1.9[max.2] depending on X/R of the short-circuit grid.
it is the highest possible instantaneous value of the short-circuit current.
I”k = Initial symmetrical short-circuit current [rms].
The electromagnetic effect a circuit [physical] element has to withstand is defined as maximum force acting on this element. For three-phase short-circuit [according IEC 60865-1]:
Fm3=miuo/(4 *pi())*sqrt(3)*ip^2/am pi()=3.14159... [in excel language] am=distance between elements[busbars].
As you can see this value does not depends on time and in any case the busbar has to withstand it.
So you cannot allow a more elevated value of the short-circuit current.
The short-circuit current in time will decrease from I”k up to Ik-steady state short-circuit and in this time the losses produced in busbars have to be limited so not to heat the circuit element more than permitted.This is the thermal effect which the busbar has to withstand.
If Ithr =rated short-time withstand current
Tkr=rated short-time
If the new current Ith is LESS than Ithr then:Ith<=Ithr*sqrt(Tkr/Tk) Tk=new short-time.Tk>Tkr
If Tk<Tkr the new current has to be NOT MORE than Ikr in any case.
So 46 kA for 1 sec [rated] could be 26.55 kA for 3 sec.
 
The steady state load current [not for short-time] depends on the downstream consumers [motors, other panels and so on].Short-circuit current depends on upstream [the supply system-utility or generators, the transformer, the low voltage cables] impedance.
For instance, let’s say the transformer ratings will be 2500 kVA/ 415V. If the short-circuit voltage will be 6% then the transformer impedance will be: 6/100*0.415^2/2.5=0.004133 ohm. Neglecting the resistance then Xtrf=Ztrf
The supply system for medium voltage short-circuit apparent power Ssys=500 MVA and system impedance will be:
Zsys [at 415 V system]=0.415^2/500=0.0003445 ohm and neglecting the resistance Xsys=Zsys.
A low voltage cable [2 parallel cables of 3*240 mm^2 copper conductors 90oC insulation- for 2*400A rated current] presents a resistance approx.0.0947 ohm/km and a reactance of 0.0819 ohm/km. The length of cable [let’s say] =17 m and the cable impedance will be:
Zcab=0.000805+j.0.000696 ohm. Total impedance will be:
Xtot=0.0003445+0.004133+0.000696=0.00517 ohm
Ztot=sqrt(0.00517^2+0.000805^2)=0.00523 ohm I”k3= three phases short-circuit current [metallic contact-no arcing].
I”K3=VoltL_L/sqrt(3)/Ztot=0.415/sqrt(3)/0.00523=45.8 kA.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
3K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
4K
Replies
12
Views
8K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
26K
Replies
4
Views
4K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
Replies
2
Views
4K