Mean Physics Teacher: Is This Fair?

[kraphysics]

I go to a good high school and am in grade 12. Most people here, by far struggle with physics the most out of any subjects. Physics seems to be the one subject that brings down everyone's marks. The final diploma exam is worth 50 % and has consistently had an average grade of about 62% so it is quite hard. In my class, everyone seems to hate the teacher and complains that the tests are too hard. His response? "So? Physics is supposed to be challenging" He says he will absolutely not make anything easier and that physics should be the hardest class. He also says his tests are meant to "separate the men from the boys". lol. I just think that attitude is a bit elitist. What do you think of teachers like this?

 

[JaredJames]

You're annoyed he wants to give you a challenging test?

Suck it up and study. You should be grateful you have a teacher that wants to push you.

 

[micromass]

I go to a good high school and am in grade 12. Most people here, by far struggle with physics the most out of any subjects. Physics seems to be the one subject that brings down everyone's marks. The final diploma exam is worth 50 % and has consistently had an average grade of about 62% so it is quite hard. In my class, everyone seems to hate the teacher and complains that the tests are too hard. His response? "So? Physics is supposed to be challenging" He says he will absolutely not make anything easier and that physics should be the hardest class. He also says his tests are meant to "separate the men from the boys". lol. I just think that attitude is a bit elitist. What do you think?

I think your teacher is correct. You will learn far more in a hard class than an easy class. In fact, the classes that I loved and remember are all the hard classes. The easy classes? Meh, who cares about them. And I certainly don't want my sciences dumbed down...

When you had a hard test and you succeeded, then you feel so good. It's a rush going through your body. That's how science feels!

And what do you expect to do in college? You won't get all easy classes there either, will you? Hard physics classes are an EXCELLENT way to prepare for college! And it will give you a great idea whether you're ready or not...

 

[HeLiXe]

lol @ separate the men from the boys I guess there are no girls in your class

My geology teacher this term was like this lol. We can see class averages, and I was so shocked that the class average was D and F for some of the major exams and assignments. I tend to appreciate teachers like this providing they are truly serious about challenging you and not just being mean. I have another teacher who seems to be giving everyone A's for everything and it really annoys me. I think it is unfair to just give everyone A's when people really need to learn.

 

[AlephZero]

What do you think of teachers like this?

There should be more of them.

The sooner kids learn to stop whining that "life isn't fair", the better.

 

[Triple_D]

Just be sure to understand that there is a difference between a "hard" teacher, and a "mean" one. A hard teacher, is one who is trying to "push you", but should still be willing to help you if you are having difficulty understanding something. Don't be afraid to ask for that help, if you need it.

 

[Pengwuino]

Physics is hard and vastly more important than your other classes in terms of learning real world skills. Few other courses teach you to apply mathematics, think critically, and develop other higher order thinking skills (if taught correctly).

 

[kraphysics]

Just be sure to understand that there is a difference between a "hard" teacher, and a "mean" one. A hard teacher, is one who is trying to "push you", but should still be willing to help you if you are having difficulty understanding something. Don't be afraid to ask for that help, if you need it.

One thing about him is that he is not a mean person. He helps people with questions and is generally pretty nice. It's just that his exams are brutal and the questions are completely different from what we studied. He insists on making questions that require "higher level thinking", whatever that means.

 

[Office_Shredder]

He insists on making questions that require "higher level thinking", whatever that means.

It means it's not just a question that's copied from a homework with different numbers, so you need to think up the way to solve it, not just memorize the solution method

 

[JaredJames]

One thing about him is that he is not a mean person. He helps people with questions and is generally pretty nice. It's just that his exams are brutal and the questions are completely different from what we studied. He insists on making questions that require "higher level thinking", whatever that means.

Sounds like one of the best types of teacher.

 

[micromass]

One thing about him is that he is not a mean person. He helps people with questions and is generally pretty nice. It's just that his exams are brutal and the questions are completely different from what we studied. He insists on making questions that require "higher level thinking", whatever that means.

Wow! I would absolutely love this guy! There's no need to call him mean, he's just trying to make you smarter!

 

[HeLiXe]

One thing about him is that he is not a mean person. He helps people with questions and is generally pretty nice. It's just that his exams are brutal and the questions are completely different from what we studied. He insists on making questions that require "higher level thinking", whatever that means.

He sounds like a great teacher. Is he testing you on things you did not learn yet, or are the questions on the test just different from the ones you studied? My calc teacher once tested us on things we didn't learn yet. I found it helpful to study a couple of chapters ahead.

 

[kraphysics]

Wow! I would absolutely love this guy! There's no need to call him mean, he's just trying to make you smarter!

yea but you have to consider the context. Universities select us on our grade 12 marks (this is Canada) so ...for people who are lazy and like rote memorization, they are getting robbed of getting into top universities because of their physics marks.

Personally, I actually kind of appreciate the teacher but do understand other people's opinions. I too am a lazy student and the fact is I was never challenged before. So I come in his class, thinking it's going to be a breaze. Well I was completely wrong! I never did any of my homework for the first two exams and got 70%! which is horrible, really. But then by the third exam, I somehow was completely absorbed in Physics and took an active interest in it. I was the only person in my grade to get 100% on the exam! But I know, I had to put in effort and really try to understand everything to do this.

 

[micromass]

yea but you have to consider the context. Universities select us on our grade 12 marks (this is Canada) so ...for people who are lazy and like rote memorization, they are getting robbed of getting into top universities because of their physics marks.

Really, that's an excuse now-a-days? "I'm sorry I failed your class, I'm too lazy, but I'm sure college will be easy..."
Guess what I think? I think lazy students don't belong in top universities. They would basically rob the chances of the hard-working, smart students out there, who DO deserve getting in a top university. Laziness will get you nowhere, hard work will!
As for people who like rote memorization: don't take physics, it actually requires understanding...

So, you're basically saying that this guy found a way to fail students who rely on rote memorization and who are lazy. Geez, that sounds like my new hero!

Personally, I actually kind of appreciate the teacher but do understand other people's opinions. I too am a lazy student and the fact is I was never challenged before. So I come in his class, thinking it's going to be a breaze. Well I was completely wrong! I never did any of my homework for the first two exams and got 70%! which is horrible, really. But then by the third exam, I somehow was completely absorbed in Physics and took an active interest in it. I was the only person in my grade to get 100% on the exam! But I know, I had to put in effort and really try to understand everything to do this.

Well, this guy challenged you and you got smarter because of him! Why do you call him mean? Not everything in life is supposed to be easy, you know?? Easy stuff is useless, you learn nothing from it. I guess you not only learned physics from this teacher, but also learned the value of hard work and understanding. This is exactly what he wanted!

 

[kraphysics]

He sounds like a great teacher. Is he testing you on things you did not learn yet, or are the questions on the test just different from the ones you studied? My calc teacher once tested us on things we didn't learn yet. I found it helpful to study a couple of chapters ahead.

No just the stuff we do but some questions do require extra knowledge occasionally which is why I love this site. I try to explore topics on my own which are outside the scope of the book to gain a better understanding. That extra knowledge really helps on the exams.
But the majority of the exam are questions which require you to apply knowledge to weird scenarios. And some are theory questions(those are the hardest )

 

[KingNothing]

You may not totally realize or enjoy it right now, but he is making you a more powerful and capable person. What you just said about how you've had to learn and take an active interest...that just warms my heart.

Plus, to be honest, even if a really lazy student did make it into the best college, they would have a lot of catching up to do and a very painful first year.

 

[Kevin_Axion]

The point is to understand the concepts, connect the dots and apply it to the world around you. Rote learning is awful, if you rote learn then you likely have no active interest in the subject and aren't willing to grasp the fundamental concepts. Take for instance a chemical engineer, had a chemical engineer been trained to rote learn and not expand upon the ideas then when he/she is working in industry and is introduced to a unique problem he/she won't be able to think intuitively. Those questions are expanding your mind and setting in motion your creativity, embrace it. The ability to solve those questions are what give inspiration and genuine belief that you truly understand the ideas and can apply them to distinct situations to make a difference in the world.

 

[ideasrule]

yea but you have to consider the context. Universities select us on our grade 12 marks (this is Canada) so ...for people who are lazy and like rote memorization, they are getting robbed of getting into top universities because of their physics marks.

Which province in Canada? I'm from Ontario, and universities here select based on grade 11 and grade 12 marks, not just grade 12. Also, the class median is included along with your grade on the transcript, so a low absolute mark won't matter if the rest of the class is much worse.

That said, there is a disappointing number of renowned Canadian universities that post grade limits, and automatically reject anybody who doesn't meet them. Never mind the fact that someone who can't add can get 98% in a summer school, whereas in some of the courses I took, the top students can barely achieve 90%.

Personally, I actually kind of appreciate the teacher but do understand other people's opinions. I too am a lazy student and the fact is I was never challenged before. So I come in his class, thinking it's going to be a breaze. Well I was completely wrong! I never did any of my homework for the first two exams and got 70%! which is horrible, really. But then by the third exam, I somehow was completely absorbed in Physics and took an active interest in it. I was the only person in my grade to get 100% on the exam! But I know, I had to put in effort and really try to understand everything to do this.

So why are you complaining? Physics, and in my opinion, all academic subjects, should be about coming up with original ideas and not rote memorization. It's true that knowing the basic concepts is essential, but they're not useful if all you can do is solve problems that others have already solved for you. I'm very glad to hear that the teacher got you interested in physics and that you're doing well. Keep up the good work!

By comparison, here's how bad my physics teacher was. He went over all the concepts in cursory detail, without going over any examples on the board. Nobody understood a thing, but he was blissfully unaware of this because there was only 1 test the entire year--which half the class cheated on--along with a dozen problem sets. This is what students do for the problem sets:

1. Obtain a copy of a graded problem set from last year's students. The teacher doesn't bother to change the questions.
2. Copy the answers.
3. Get 100% without knowing a thing

I'd much rather have a decent teacher like yours who grades hard, than someone like this.

 

[Kevin_Axion]

I'm from Ontario too, in relation to the grade 11 marks they aren't very important. I've spoken to several of my teachers and they told me that grade 11 is hardly considered. It's mostly used for reference when considering early acceptance.

 

[KrisOhn]

yea but you have to consider the context. Universities select us on our grade 12 marks (this is Canada) so ...for people who are lazy and like rote memorization, they are getting robbed of getting into top universities because of their physics marks.

Lol, Saskatchewan here.

I know the exact kind of person you are talking about, she did everything by memorization and usually pulled off 90's. When she got into grade 12 she dropped out of Calculus because she thought it was too hard, and she got terrible marks in physics. She still made it into university but she dropped out after a year because she couldn't make the grades using her learning method and she didn't try any others. It's probably for the better if these people won't make university marks; it'll save them money.

 

[rootX]

I don't remember my average - it wasn't amazing (maybe high 80s) and I didn't have much volunteer experience. I honestly said on my applications that all volunteer work I did was for meeting my school requirements. I had highest marks in geometry math something -97%- and our class average was around 60. However, I didn't do too good on the easiest math course - data statistics, neither on physics or chemistry.

Nonetheless, I got accepted for all (good) places I applied to, and I even had good scholarship offer from one of the universities.

 

[ideasrule]

I don't remember my average - it wasn't amazing (maybe high 80s) and I didn't have much volunteer experience. I honestly said on my applications that all volunteer work I did was for meeting my school requirements. I had highest marks in geometry math something -97%- and our class average was around 60. However, I didn't do too good on the easiest math course - data statistics, neither on physics or chemistry.

Just curious: why would you volunteer that information if the application didn't ask for it?

 

[zif.]

yea but you have to consider the context. Universities select us on our grade 12 marks (this is Canada) so ...for people who are lazy and like rote memorization, they are getting robbed of getting into top universities because of their physics marks.

...

Really?

They aren't getting 'robbed' of anything. They're being rewarded with exactly what they earned.

Top universities don't want lazy students that depend on rote memorization.

 

[Femme_physics]

I'd love him to be my teacher! That's the way it should be!

Although does physics separate the women from the girls, too? :P

 

[cobalt124]

Ha. You're very lucky to have this teacher. You've taken me back to when I took my "A" Levels (U.K.). Hardest two years of my education. Didn't do brilliantly, but passed, and the experience set me up for university life, and life lessons in general. Some things are hard, but the rewards are worth it.

 

[JaredJames]

Why do I get the feeling this thread hasn't gone the way the OP would have hoped.

 

[cobalt124]

Doesn't look like it!

 

[micromass]

Why do I get the feeling this thread hasn't gone the way the OP would have hoped.

Seriously, what did he expect? This is a forum full of physics and math die-hards who enjoy hard problems and who are used to working very hard. If he simply wanted to be told that his teacher is a mean old man, then he should have considered scientologyforums or something

 

[Jack21222]

for people who are lazy and like rote memorization, they are getting robbed of getting into top universities because of their physics marks.

I know this has already been said, but I wanted to pile on. If you're lazy and rely on rote memorization, you don't DESERVE to be in the top universities. In fact, you don't deserve to be in any university at all.

 

[Chi Meson]

I just now realized that I am way too "nice."

Where's this guy teaching, I think I need a new mentor.

 

[physics girl phd]

I just now realized that I am way too "nice."

Where's this guy teaching, I think I need a new mentor.

There's nothing wrong with being "nice" as long as you still have standards. I think that the OP expresses too much that the teacher is "mean" because he is "hard." That correlation is, in perhaps most often made by the students looking to get a grade, but no knowledge (aka those ones that copy the HW assignments and try to get last years tests, hoping for the same questions). Unfortunately, there's enough educators out there looking for good evaluations (or just plain old lazy), that this happens, and these students get accustomed to it (as do, sadly, admissions offices).

I like to think of myself as "nice" with solid standards appropriate to the courses I teach... and I suspect, based on your history of postings, that you're the same.

 

[BobG]

My calc teacher once tested us on things we didn't learn yet. I found it helpful to study a couple of chapters ahead.

This I don't understand. What's the goal of including these type of questions? Are they easy questions just to make sure the students are reading ahead instead of studying solely for the upcoming exam? Or are these really just questions solvable by what you've already learned, but just presented in a different environment that leads into what you're getting ready to study?

But the majority of the exam are questions which require you to apply knowledge to weird scenarios.

This I do understand - especially when learning some fundamental principles that apply to many different scenarios.

 

[Newai]

Any chance we can see one of his hard test questions?

 

[drizzle]

My best teachers are the 'hard' ones.

 

[jhae2.718]

I can't say I've had any mean physics teachers, though I've had a few median ones.

 

[Chi Meson]

How many people right now are working on a "root-mean-square" joke?

one...

 

[HeLiXe]

This I don't understand. What's the goal of including these type of questions? Are they easy questions just to make sure the students are reading ahead instead of studying solely for the upcoming exam? Or are these really just questions solvable by what you've already learned, but just presented in a different environment that leads into what you're getting ready to study?

Well this was in calculus one, and I actually got the highest score on that exam, which was an "F". The questions on the exam were not essentially "hard," but we did not learn the material yet. We learned transcendental differentiation and she tested on that, but also included implicit differentiation, which was a couple of chapters ahead...so definitely not something we could have solved with what we learned. This is still a pattern in the class with exercises, and occasionally on exams, although not as drastic as the aforementioned exam. I have not asked her why she does this.

 

[BobG]

Well this was in calculus one, and I actually got the highest score on that exam, which was an "F". The questions on the exam were not essentially "hard," but we did not learn the material yet. We learned transcendental differentiation and she tested on that, but also included implicit differentiation, which was a couple of chapters ahead...so definitely not something we could have solved with what we learned. This is still a pattern in the class with exercises, and occasionally on exams, although not as drastic as the aforementioned exam. I have not asked her why she does this.

I wonder if she realizes that when they come out with a new edition of a textbook, sometimes they move stuff around.

In my textbook, they put Newton's method in a fairly late chapter for some reason, which meant it wasn't taught until Calc 2. Their next edition moved it earlier in the book (which I thought made more sense). Fortunately, I had the same teacher for both Calc 1 and Calc 2, so he knew what material he'd taught most of the students the quarter before and knew what material he hadn't. However, for students that didn't take those two classes back to back for some reason - they'd skip right past Newton's method and never learn it.

 

[Dembadon]

One thing about him is that he is not a mean person. He helps people with questions and is generally pretty nice. It's just that his exams are brutal and the questions are completely different from what we studied. He insists on making questions that require "higher level thinking", whatever that means.

It sounds like your instructor is doing an excellent job in preparing you for studies in any respectable university.

I think high school teachers who don't challenge students on the same level as university professors are doing them a huge disservice. Hand-holding produces ill-prepared students, no matter what subject they're studying. Embrace his style; he's doing you a favor. You need to become an independent learner and think of the teacher/professor as a guide. This perspective will help you in college, trust me.

 

[Femme_physics]

How many people right now are working on a "root-mean-square" joke?

one...

That gets you a +1 Urkel point!