Measuring distance a sound wave travels

Click For Summary
SUMMARY

This discussion focuses on measuring the distance that sound waves travel from the G string of a violin to the feet of the bridge. The primary frequency discussed is 196 Hz, corresponding to the G string. Participants emphasize that measuring distance is less relevant than understanding the time it takes for vibrations to reach different points on the bridge, particularly due to the presence of incisions and holes that affect wave propagation. Techniques such as using a microphone to plot wave phases and considering the sound post's position are suggested for optimizing sound transmission.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of sound wave propagation and frequency (196 Hz for G string)
  • Familiarity with violin anatomy, specifically the bridge and sound post
  • Knowledge of acoustic measurement techniques, including microphone placement
  • Basic principles of wave phase and delay in acoustics
NEXT STEPS
  • Research methods for measuring wave phase using microphones
  • Explore the impact of bridge design on sound wave transmission
  • Learn about optimal sound post placement techniques in violins
  • Investigate acoustic modeling software for simulating sound wave behavior
USEFUL FOR

Violin makers, acoustics engineers, musicians interested in sound optimization, and anyone studying the physics of musical instruments.

msergeant
Messages
3
Reaction score
0
I would like to be able to measure the distance a sound wave travels. This is for a violin bridge and what I would like to do is apply a frequency corresponding to the frequency the string (196 hz for the g string) and determine the distance the wave traveled to get to the foot of the bridge. Is there a method to do this?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
How are you generating this frequency?
 
The answer to your question is: 'with a ruler' between the bridge and the nut or, possibly from the bow to the bridge. But I don't think that's what you actually want to know. Could you elaborate?
 
No it is not. I want to know how far the vibration travels from the G string ,for example, to the bass foot of the bridge and how far the same vibration travels to the treble foot. it is not as simple as using a ruler as there are incisions and holes in the bridge that are there to slow the vibrations down. The goal here is to get the vibration to the feet at the same time from all strings being played.
 
paisiello2,
Not sure at this point. Thought that would be the easier of the two problems to solve. Thinking electronic generation, but open to suggestions
 
msergeant said:
No it is not. I want to know how far the vibration travels from the G string ,for example, to the bass foot of the bridge and how far the same vibration travels to the treble foot. it is not as simple as using a ruler as there are incisions and holes in the bridge that are there to slow the vibrations down. The goal here is to get the vibration to the feet at the same time from all strings being played.
It may be that you mean "how fast" and not how far? It seems that you know both where the wave starts and where it ends. So if you really want to know how far, sophiecentaur's answer is it. No holes or incisions matter.
 
I think I get what you need. You are not so much interested in distance as time* this can be found in terms of the phase of the waves as they travel / spread out across the table (?) of the instrument. Put a vibrating source at a particular point on the surface and a microphone at various other points on the surface and you can plot the locus of points on the surface that have equal delays over the path.
I am not quite sure why you would want the same delay in the paths from all four strings because the sources are at different frequencies and the start times of the notes (when you double stop) are not likely to be the same in any case. It sounds reasonable that you may need the waves from one side (foot) of the bridge (for each string separately) to get focussed so that they arrive at the same time at the sound post as from the other foot. Iirc, there are rules of thumb for placing the sound post in the optimum position. I guess, with this phase method, you could help to identify the point better. It strikes me that it may be best to use the sound post as the source of the vibrations and then look at the phases (dual trace scope?) of what arrives at the two feet of the bridge or anywhere on the table. Reversing the signal direction would be perfectly valid.
*The thickness of the wood will vary over the table and so will the speed of transmission so distance will not actually tell you reliably about the delay (which is what counts, I think).
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
6K
  • · Replies 31 ·
2
Replies
31
Views
4K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
3K
  • · Replies 236 ·
8
Replies
236
Views
16K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
3K
  • · Replies 19 ·
Replies
19
Views
7K