Minimum force required to form sphere

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around determining the minimum force required to form a sphere, specifically in the context of fluid mechanics and hydrostatics. Participants are exploring the implications of a pinhole at the top of the sphere and how it affects the pressure and forces acting on the system.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss vertical force balances and the role of pressure in the system. Questions arise about the significance of the pinhole and how it influences the calculations. There are attempts to derive expressions for forces acting on hemispherical surfaces and considerations of integrating pressure over areas.

Discussion Status

The discussion is active, with participants offering hints and exploring various mathematical approaches. Some participants express uncertainty about the complexity of the problem and seek clarification on specific aspects, such as the integration limits and the effects of atmospheric pressure. There is a recognition of the need for further exploration of the forces involved.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the presence of different fluids inside and outside the hemisphere, which raises questions about the assumptions being made regarding pressure and force calculations. The discussion also highlights the potential complications introduced by the pinhole and the need for additional equations to arrive at a numerical solution.

  • #31
Tanya Sharma said:
Do you mind showing how you would arrive at the result using above approach .
Well. Let me get you started. The force per unit area exerted by the atmosphere on the curved surface of the sphere is ##-p_{atm}\vec{i}_r##, where ##\vec{i}_r## is the unit vector in the radial direction in spherical coordinates. Do you know how to determine the x component of this unit vector in terms of the spherical coordinate angles φ and θ? Do you know how to determine the differential element of area on the surface of the sphere in terms of R, dφ, and dθ?

Chet
 
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  • #32
TSny said:
The external atmospheric force acting on one of the hemispherical curved surfaces of the sphere filled with water is independent of what fluid is inside the sphere.

The left figure below shows a region of the atmosphere that has the same shape as a hemisphere of the sphere filled with water. The arrows indicate the external atmospheric force acting on the flat and curved surfaces of this portion of the atmosphere. The figure on the right is the sphere filled with water and the arrow indicates the external atmospheric force acting on the curved portion of one of the hemispheres of the sphere. All three forces F are equal. The force on the far left is easy to calculate.

Thanks .

Here is what I had been thinking .

Let the flat surface be in the z plane . The force on a very small surface element will be ##pd\vec{A}## . This ##d\vec{A}## could be decomposed into three area elements along the three planes . Now we could find another element on the surface such that the two elements ##d\vec{A_x}## and ##d\vec{A_y}## get canceled . So that we are only left with ##d\vec{A_z}## . Now ##\int d\vec{A_z} = \pi R^2## .

I am not sure if I could express myself properly . Does it make any sense ?
 
  • #33
Tanya Sharma said:
Let the flat surface be in the z plane . The force on a very small surface element will be ##pd\vec{A}## . This ##d\vec{A}## could be decomposed into three area elements along the three planes . Now we could find another element on the surface such that the two elements ##d\vec{A_x}## and ##d\vec{A_y}## get canceled . So that we are only left with ##d\vec{A_z}## . Now ##\int d\vec{A_z} = \pi R^2## .

I am not sure if I could express myself properly . Does it make any sense ?

Yes. That sounds very good.
 
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  • #34
TSny said:
Yes. That sounds very good.

Hard to believe that you liked my reasoning :smile: .
 
  • #35
Chestermiller said:
Well. Let me get you started. The force per unit area exerted by the atmosphere on the curved surface of the sphere is ##-p_{atm}\vec{i}_r##, where ##\vec{i}_r## is the unit vector in the radial direction in spherical coordinates. Do you know how to determine the x component of this unit vector in terms of the spherical coordinate angles φ and θ? Do you know how to determine the differential element of area on the surface of the sphere in terms of R, dφ, and dθ?

Chet

Thank you Chet .

Sorry , but as of now I do not possesses required mathematical skills :oops:.
 
  • #36
Tanya Sharma said:
Hard to believe that you liked my reasoning :smile: .
I know. Probably some aftereffect of the eclipse of the moon last night. o0)
 
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  • #37
TSny said:
I know. Probably some aftereffect of the eclipse of the moon last night. o0)

:biggrin:
 

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