MMX and the earth's rotational sagnac

[JesseM]

No,GPS did not consider Sagnac until the 80's.

Are you just saying that until the 80s all the calculations involving GPS devices were done in the nonrotating ECI frame rather than the ECEF frame? If not, where are you getting this claim? Certainly the GPS designers would have known about the Sagnac effect, which dates back a lot further than 1973.

Anyway bring a modern article from a mainstream university. I want to see it.

Find it yourself--try google scholar. It's pretty obvious this isn't a matter of you accepting relativity but believing modern physicists don't accept MMX, you are trying to say physicists are wrong to accept MMX as evidence for relativity, and are using this argument to question SR itself (as evidenced by your rhetorical question "So, what is the experimental basis of special relativity without MMX?") I'm not going to play the game of looking for a source that exactly matches your specifications, but just so you can't say you weren't shown a source, here is a book that discusses modern variations on MMX on page 152 which you can read on google books, it's published by Springer which is a respected publisher of scientific texts (and the book's original publication date is 1999, this is a 2nd publishing from 2006). And here is the abstract of a published journal article which backs up my claim that rotational effects into account are not precisely zero, but in the MMX they would be too small to make any observable difference to the experimental results:

Reinterpretation of the Michelson-Morley experiment based on the GPS Sagnac correction

By examining the effects of rotational and orbital motions of the Earth on wave propagation in the global positioning system and an intercontinental microwave link, it is pointed out that the Earth's orbital motion has no influence on these earthbound wave propagations, while the Earth's rotation does contribute to the Sagnac effect. As the propagation mechanism in the Michelson-Morley experiment cannot be different from that in the aforementioned ones, it is concluded that due to the Earth's rotation, the shift in interference fringe in this famous experiment is not exactly zero. However, by virtue of the round-trip propagation path, this shift becomes second order and hence is too small to observe within the present precision.

Anyway, feel free to try to continue to argue that relativity should predict a non-null result for the MMX, but you can't claim ignorance now, so doing that will probably just get you banned.

 

[berkeman]

Not sure about the ban yet, but this thread is closed for now.