How Does Momentum Compare to Kinetic Energy in Stopping a Vehicle?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion focuses on the comparison between momentum and kinetic energy in the context of stopping vehicles. Participants explore the implications of each quantity in terms of the forces required to bring vehicles to rest, considering different scenarios and definitions related to stopping dynamics.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that while a car has more kinetic energy than a truck, it has less momentum, leading to confusion regarding which vehicle is harder to stop.
  • Another participant explains that using a constant force to stop two vehicles in equal time requires a greater force for the one with larger momentum, but the energy required corresponds to the initial kinetic energy.
  • It is suggested that defining momentum as "how hard it is to stop something" lacks precision and may not be useful without a clear context.
  • Participants discuss that stopping dynamics can vary based on whether one considers the time taken to stop or the distance traveled during the stopping process.
  • A participant seeks clarification on the relationship between force and impulse, stating that force is the rate of change of momentum while impulse represents the total change in momentum.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the definitions and implications of momentum and kinetic energy in stopping scenarios. There is no consensus on a singular definition of "hardness of stopping," and the discussion remains unresolved regarding the best way to conceptualize these physical quantities.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the importance of context when discussing stopping dynamics, noting that definitions may vary based on the specific scenario being analyzed. The discussion also touches on the potential confusion arising from the relationship between force and impulse.

Jimmy87
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Please could someone explain the following situation. A truck weighs 4 tonnes and travels at 18m/s. A car on the same road, weighs 1.4 tonnes and is traveling at 35 m/s. The car has more kinetic energy but less momentum. My book says that momentum is how hard it is to stop something which is where my confusion comes in. To stop the car would require a force over a certain distance to bring it to rest and the work done would be equal to the KE. Since the car has more kinetic energy the force will need to be applied over a longer distance (or a greater force over the same distance) so surely the car is harder to stop? But it has less momentum so according to that definition it shouldn't?
 
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If you take a constant force, then you have F=\frac{\Delta p}{\Delta t}. Because the final momentum is zero, it turns into |F|=\frac{p}{\Delta t}. So if you want to stop two things in equal times, it needs a greater force to stop the one with larger momentum. But because the energy it takes is equal to object's initial kinetic energy, it takes more energy for the one having more kinetic energy.
Its not a good idea to say "momentum is how hard it is to stop something" because there should be an exact meaning to the "hardness of stopping something" which can only be conventional and is almost of no use.
In fact its not a good idea to give such definitions for physical quantities. They're only defined in relation with other quantities.
 
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You've got two cars. You try to bring them to a stop using the same force. You find out that one takes longer to stop, but over a shorter distance. The other you can stop faster, but it travels farther.
There's an obvious difference between those cars. You call the property that makes a car go longer momentum, and the property that makes it go farther - kinetic energy.

Whichever you choose to call "harder to stop" is a matter of context, really.
One requires more force to stop it in a given time interval, but the other requires more force to stop it over a given distance.
 
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Bandersnatch said:
You've got two cars. You try to bring them to a stop using the same force. You find out that one takes longer to stop, but over a shorter distance. The other you can stop faster, but it travels farther.
There's an obvious difference between those cars. You call the property that makes a car go longer momentum, and the property that makes it go farther - kinetic energy.

Whichever you choose to call "harder to stop" is a matter of context, really.
One requires more force to stop it in a given time interval, but the other requires more force to stop it over a given distance.

Thanks guys, that makes sense. Could someone also clarify the difference between force and impulse. Force is dp/dt whereas impulse is dp/dt x t. My book deals with them on separate pages but makes a statement which makes them sound like the same. It says the f= dp/dt and says that this means that a force changes your momentum. Later on its states the equation for impulse and says that an impulse changes your momentum. Looking at the equation, is the force the rate of change of momentum i.e. How quickly it is changing whereas impulse is simply the total change in momentum?
 
Jimmy87 said:
force the rate of change of momentum i.e. How quickly it is changing
impulse is simply the total change in momentum

That's it!
 
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