Nasty Integral - Help with Trig Substitution

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around evaluating the integral \(\int_{-p}^{p} \frac{2p}{(1+v^2)\sqrt{p^2 + v^2 +1 }} dv\), which involves trigonometric substitution. Participants are exploring the complexities of the integral and the challenges posed by the substitution process.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts a trigonometric substitution by letting \(v = \alpha \tan{\theta}\) and expresses the integral in terms of \(\theta\). They encounter difficulties with the resulting expressions, particularly with the term involving \((1 - \alpha \tan{\theta})\). Other participants suggest clarifying notation and adjusting limits of integration, while also acknowledging the ongoing complexity of the problem.

Discussion Status

The discussion is active, with participants providing feedback on notation and suggesting adjustments to the integral's limits. There is recognition of the challenges involved, but no consensus or resolution has been reached regarding the best approach to simplify the integral.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the importance of correctly interpreting trigonometric identities and the implications of variable substitutions on the limits of integration. The original poster expresses frustration with the complexity of the integral, indicating that further exploration is needed.

mrworf
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Homework Statement


<br /> \int_{-p}^{p} \frac{2p}{(1+v^2)\sqrt{p^2 + v^2 +1 }} dv<br />


Homework Equations


1 + \tan{\theta}^2 = \sec{\theta}^2

The Attempt at a Solution


I thought the best way to go about this was to rename some constants.
Let \alpha^2 = 1 + p^2 so that we are left with:
<br /> \int_{-p}^{p} \frac{2p}{(1+v^2)\sqrt{\alpha^2+ v^2 }} dv<br />

i then make the variable substitution:
v = \alpha \tan{\theta}
dv = \alpha \sec{\theta}^2 d\theta

we now have:
<br /> 2p \int_{-p}^{p} \frac{1}{(1+\alpha^2 \tan^2{\theta})\sqrt{\alpha^2(1+\tan^2{\theta} )}} \alpha \sec{\theta}^2 d\theta<br />

<br /> 2p \int_{-p}^{p} \frac{1}{(1+\alpha^2 \tan^2{\theta})\alpha \sec{\theta}} \alpha \sec{\theta}^2 d\theta<br />

<br /> 2p \int_{-p}^{p} \frac{ \sec{\theta}}{(1+\alpha^2 \tan^2{\theta})} d\theta<br />

at this point i hit a roadblock - the (1 - \alpha \tan{\theta} ) term seems to be an inextricable pain . other substitutions leave me with a similar problem.
If anyone can point me in the direction of a better trig substitution, or perhaps an identity then your help would be greatly appreciated.
thanks for reading
-mrworf
 
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mrworf said:

Homework Statement


\int_{-p}^{p} \frac{2p}{(1+v^2)\sqrt{p^2 + v^2 +1 }} dv

Homework Equations


1 + \tan{\theta}^2 = \sec{\theta}^2

The Attempt at a Solution


I thought the best way to go about this was to rename some constants.
Let \alpha^2 = 1 + p^2 so that we are left with:<br /> \int_{-p}^{p} \frac{2p}{(1+v^2)\sqrt{\alpha^2+ v^2 }} dv

i then make the variable substitution:
v = \alpha \tan{\theta}
dv = \alpha \sec{\theta}^2 d\theta

we now have:
2p \int_{-p}^{p} \frac{1}{(1+\alpha^2 \tan^2{\theta})\sqrt{\alpha^2(1+\tan^2{\theta} )}} \alpha \sec{\theta}^2 d\theta

2p \int_{-p}^{p} \frac{1}{(1+\alpha^2 \tan^2{\theta})\alpha \sec{\theta}} \alpha \sec{\theta}^2 d\theta

2p \int_{-p}^{p} \frac{ \sec{\theta}}{(1+\alpha^2 \tan^2{\theta})} d\theta

at this point i hit a roadblock - the (1 - \alpha \tan{\theta} ) term seems to be an inextricable pain . other substitutions leave me with a similar problem.
If anyone can point me in the direction of a better trig substitution, or perhaps an identity then your help would be greatly appreciated.
thanks for reading
-mrworf
Hello mrworf. Welcome to PF !

First of all, \ \sec\theta^2\ means \ \sec(\theta^2)\,\ whereas \ \sec^2\theta\ means \ (\sec\theta)^2\ .\ I'm sure you want the latter for this problem.

Also, you need to change the limits of integration to reflect the substitution you did.
 
right on, with sammyS' suggestion, my equation becomes:

2 p \int_{\tan^{-1}{\frac{p}{\alpha}}}^{\tan^{-1}{\frac{-p}{\alpha}}} \bigg[ \frac{\sec{\theta}}{(1+\alpha^2 \tan^2{\theta})} \bigg] d\theta
 
mrworf said:
right on, with sammyS' suggestion, my equation becomes:

\displaystyle 2 p \int_{\tan^{-1}{\frac{p}{\alpha}}}^{\tan^{-1}{\frac{-p}{\alpha}}} \bigg[ \frac{\sec{\theta}}{(1+\alpha^2 \tan^2{\theta})} \bigg] d\theta
I admit, it's still quite nasty !
 

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