Non-equilibrium Statistical Mechanics of Liquids

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion focuses on the non-equilibrium statistical mechanics of liquids, particularly the challenges of computing molecular transport equations compared to gases. Participants explore the use of the BBGKY hierarchy and the implications of intermolecular interactions on kinetic equations for liquids.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that the BBGKY hierarchy is used to derive equations for particle distribution and correlation functions, highlighting the complexity due to significant intermolecular interactions in liquids.
  • Another participant mentions that the thermal kinetic energy of molecules in liquids is comparable to interparticle interaction energy, complicating the calculations of transport properties.
  • There is a proposal to develop a kinetic equation for liquids that does not rely on higher-order correlation functions, suggesting a closed set of equations with mean field and two-body correlation terms.
  • One participant questions whether a theory based solely on two-body correlations can accurately predict transport properties like viscosity and thermal conductivity.
  • Another participant references the historical challenges of using only two-body correlations in liquid theories, indicating mixed success in predictions.
  • A later reply asks for clarification on the sufficiency of two-body correlation models for specific types of liquids and the potential accuracy of models incorporating three-body correlations while neglecting higher orders.
  • One participant points out that the "Fermi liquid" is a well-studied example where a Boltzmann equation can be derived using only two-body interactions, suggesting that this approach can be effective in certain cases.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the effectiveness of using only two-body correlations in kinetic models for liquids. While some suggest it may be sufficient in specific cases, others highlight the historical challenges and mixed results associated with this approach. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the necessity of higher-order correlations for accurate predictions.

Contextual Notes

Participants note limitations in the historical success of two-body correlation models and the uncertainty surrounding the sufficiency of these models for various types of liquids. There are also unresolved questions about the accuracy of models that include three-body correlations while neglecting higher orders.

linkrid
Messages
2
Reaction score
0
TL;DR
Do I need triple and higher correlation functions in this equations to make non-Equilibrium kinetic models that describe liquids?
Molecular Transport equations for Liquids are harder to compute than that for gases, because intermolecular interactions are far more important in liquids. A System of equations for particle Distribution function and the correlation functions (BBGKY-Hierarchy) is used in General. For gases, it is possible to derive e.g. the Boltzmann equation from the BBGKY-hierarchy. The structure of this hierarchy is given by

d/dt f_n + L_n f_n = C_n(f_(n+1))

with n-particle Distribution function f_n, n-particle Liouville Operator L_n and the n-particle collision Operator C_n that depends on the next higher Partition function f_(n+1). We can do an Expansion for the n-particle Distribution in Terms of correlation functions, e.g. f_2(x_1,x_2) = f_1(x_1) f_1(x_2)+g_2(x_1,x_2) for a two-body correlation function g_2 and Phase-space coordinates x. After some calculus, we can obtain equation of Motion for every correlation function.

Frequently I have heard that in liquids, the thermal kinetic Energy (that is kT) of a molecule is of similar magnitude as the interparticle interaction Energy. Also the collision Operator scales with particle number density times the effective volume of a particle (that is the volume it occupies and the volume, where it can attract other particles); in liquids this quantity cannot be assumed as a small perturbation. Some People say because of These reasons the hierarchy would couple to third and higher order correlations; this would make the calculations extremely complicated.

But can we develop a kinetic equation valid for liquids without incorporating higher correlation functions? When we say g_3 = 0 we have a closed set of equations. The Terms that account for intermolecular interactions would be

- A mean field force term, where the potential is averaged over the particle Distribution function (see also Vlasov equation, Hartree-Fock method, ...)
- A 2-body correlation term that couples to the inter-particle potential, but also accounts for the Motion of particles in an effective potential

One note to the 2-body correlation term: There will be a linear equation for g_2 in the form

A*g_2 = S

where S is the source of correlation dependent on Partition function and A is an effective Liouville Operator containing also the interparticle potential. The Operator A can, due to effective potential, Shield the particle from getting correlations with other particles. Would a Theory up to 2-body correlations predict characteristic Parameters of a simple liquid like viscosity, thermal conductivity, … with sufficient accuracy? Or are many-body correlations mandatory for having not too large Deviation of transport quantities from the experimental values?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
Start with this book:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/0123870321/?tag=pfamazon01-20

But I would say the history of theories using only 2-body correlations for liquids is not great. Sometimes things work, sometimes they don't, and I don't think people have had much success predicting ahead of time which it's going to be.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: linkrid
Dear Mr. Grayce,

thank you very much for your Reply! In which cases a kinetic model that incorporates only 2-body correlations is sufficient for liquids? Is it sufficient for Special types of liquids?

And models that have 3-body correlations, but neglecting (or only roughly modeling) 4-body and higher order correlations? Will they have much better accuracy or are These still inaccurate, too?

A Reply I would highly acknowledge.
 
I just wanted to point out that one of the simplest and best studied liquids is the "Fermi liquid" for which a Boltzmann equation can be derived and inclusion of only two body interactions is a good approximation.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
1K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 20 ·
Replies
20
Views
6K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 19 ·
Replies
19
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
7K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K