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Phoenix lights return (with video)

  1. Feb 9, 2007 #1
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2007
  2. jcsd
  3. Feb 9, 2007 #2

    Ivan Seeking

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    I am confused: Why are you posting a video of flares? Even in the event ten years ago, it was the intial reports of a craft that "flew directly overhead" and that was "large enough to land our entire fleet of B2 bombers on" that was of interest. The military just happened to drop some flares later on that caused a great deal of confusion; and judging by this report, still causes confusion. AFAIK, it is an established fact that [ten years ago] UFO reports of a large delta-shaped craft were coming into radio stations about an hour before the flares were even dropped. To throw this in the mix now only adds to the confusion.
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2007
  4. Feb 10, 2007 #3
    Well i posted this simply because it looks so similar to the famous 1997 video. I cant explain the witness sightings back then (obviously this video doesnt), but do u think this explains the video?
     
  5. Feb 11, 2007 #4

    Ivan Seeking

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    I had assumed that the entire Phoenix lights incident of 97 was nothing but flares until I learned of the earlier radio reports. But, yes, I do think what made it on TV was nothing but military parachute flares. From my pov this was fairly well established using an overlay of the event with a daytime shot. As the flares dropped below the distant mountain ridge, they appeared to blink out. The match of the overlay was exact.

    I also think that something else described as a very large delta shaped craft, one described by one witness as being large enough to land our entire fleet of B2 bombers on, may have been seen by hundreds of witnesses earlier that evening. As nearly as I can tell, and based on the timing of the public reports, this is what caused the initial radio reports about an hour before the flares were sighted. Many people have been interviewed who tell approximately the same story. And they don't describe it as a distant set of lights over the mountains, they say that it flew directly over their houses.

    I would have to check to be sure of my facts here, but I believe that reports of a similar craft came in from neighboring States before and after the Phoenix event.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2007
  6. Mar 4, 2007 #5

    Ivan Seeking

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    http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070301/NEWS07/703010425/1001/NEWS

    Also, from the report above:
    Yet, we find this
    http://www.ufoevidence.org/documents/doc1273.htm
     
  7. Mar 16, 2007 #6
    Heres a new video supposedly about the phoenix lights craft:

    Actual video is on this page, under the link "the intruder":
    http://www.azfamily.com/unexplained/stories/KTVKUnEx20070313_show.e1ffc17.html
     
  8. Mar 22, 2007 #7
  9. Mar 25, 2007 #8

    Ivan Seeking

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  10. Mar 28, 2007 #9
    Gov. Symington sighting

    Symington saw the triangle at about 8:30 PM. He did not see
    lights at 10 PM (flares).
     
  11. Mar 28, 2007 #10

    Ivan Seeking

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    Welcome to PF Bruce Maccabee.

    Are you the real Bruce Maccabee or just having fun with us here?
     
  12. Mar 28, 2007 #11
    I'm the "real one" ( like a "real UFO"). I happened to "bump into" this web site when I googled on JAL 1628. I found a threat discussing that sighting with the discussants apparently arguing from partial ignorance of the sighting facts so I have posted a web site (mine) where the complete story with illustrations is presented. Then I happened to notice this discussion of the Phoenix lights and Symington so I added a tidbit of info. IMHO at 10 PM flares but at 8:30 PM, a TRue UFO (TRUFO).
     
  13. Mar 28, 2007 #12
    I have never been able to accept the flare explanation for one big reason. The lights were in an almost perfect formation and equidistant. For a number of F16's to have dropped parachute flares that perfectly at night would be virtually impossible.

    That doesnt mean it was an alien spacecraft, only the word "unidentified" applies here. B 2's were in the testing stages at that time and they primarily flew at night. If they were flying in the Phoenix area they could not have risked a mid air collision with passenger planes from nearby Sky Harbor airport. The solution: turn on some lights.

    Why did some disappear from view before the others? They flew into the restricted zone of Luke AFB and turned out the lights as they approached for a landing. Or they simply flew out towards the bombing range and turned the lights back off.

    The one thing the military did not want to see in the News: Stealth Bombers Make Night Landing At Luke AFB.
     
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2007
  14. Mar 28, 2007 #13

    Ivan Seeking

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    In that event, I wish you a very hearty and warm welcome to PF. I have followed your work for many years.

    You may enjoy taking a peek at our UFO Napster - stickied at the top of the forum page. Of course, within you will find a number of your own papers linked, so you may want to skip over those. :biggrin: Also, please feel free to add links to any of your papers that have been missed.
     
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2007
  15. Mar 29, 2007 #14
    Triangulation using the videos and ground references shows that the lights were far southwest of Phoenix, not over Phoenix. Also, they slowly dropped downward and toward the east, consistent with parachute flares falling in an eastward moving air mass (weather shows the air was moving eastward).
    See http://brumac.8k.com/phoenixlights1.html and also http://brumac.8k.com/PhoenixSupplement
     
  16. Jul 14, 2007 #15

    Ivan Seeking

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    Last night on Larry King, former Governer Symington restated his account of the 1997 event. Again he confirms that what he saw passed over Phoenix at about 8:00 PM, so this was not the flares sighted later.

    http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0707/13/lkl.02.html

    I don't think the following quote is correct:
    I heard him say that he went out to look at the Phoenix lights, which after a moment I took to mean the lights of Phoenix, and not the flares. If he did specify that he meant the lights being filmed, which I suspect was added by the transcriptionist due to a misunderstanding of the content, I didn't hear it. I guess it is possible that I was thinking about the apparent contradiction wrt the time and missed something, but since I immediately caught this I tend to doubt that I missed any qualifiers.

    I didn't see any streaming video available, but they do often run these shows a few times, so if anyone sees this, please pay attention to this comment and then post what you hear. Note that this is very near the end of the show.

    If you go back and read the entire transcript, note that as usual, Shermer doesn't even know the basic facts. He only had an elementary understanding of the event, and apparently no previous knowledge of the original event at 8PM.
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2007
  17. Aug 5, 2007 #16

    Ivan Seeking

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    I happened to catch this again last night and the transcript was correct. So even though he clearly states that he saw another craft in addition to the "Phoenix lights", there appears to be a contradiction in the time. He says that he went out to look at the "Phoenix lights" at about 8PM.
     
  18. Nov 9, 2007 #17
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 9, 2007
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