Physics with the help of programming.

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between physics and programming, particularly whether programming can be used to infer every law of physics. Participants explore the historical context of physics, its mathematical foundations, and the role of computers in modeling physical systems.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that physics has historically been intertwined with philosophy, but this relationship has changed, with a shift towards a more mathematical understanding of physics.
  • Another participant counters that physics and philosophy have often been opposed, citing historical examples such as Galileo's heliocentric model.
  • Some participants argue that while mathematics is the language of physics, it does not imply that nature itself is composed mathematically.
  • There is a discussion about the capabilities of programming, with one participant noting that computers can only process data as programmed and cannot independently infer laws of physics without human input.
  • A mention is made of a program developed by Cornell University that can deduce equations from experimental data, but it does not explain the underlying theory.
  • Participants express differing views on the extent to which computers can model physical systems and the implications of their outputs, emphasizing that results depend heavily on the input provided.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express multiple competing views regarding the historical relationship between physics and philosophy, the role of mathematics in physics, and the capabilities of programming in inferring physical laws. The discussion remains unresolved with no consensus reached.

Contextual Notes

Some statements reflect assumptions about the nature of mathematics and its application in physics, as well as the limitations of computer programming in deriving physical laws. The discussion highlights the complexity of these relationships without resolving them.

rahaverhma
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I am studying physics. I have concluded that since ancient time, physics have been understood with the help of philosophy, now iI am seeing that the physics is turning into more mathematical seems like nature is a matrix composed mathematically.
And computer is running as best candidate for the understanding of mathematics. With the help of programming, i want to know, can we infer every law of physics? yeah and with it we may require some other engineerings too. So, can we?
 
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You need to learn some programming. Computers are not magic. They can't infer anything unless the programmer has created a program to process the data.

Cornell University developed a program that given enough experimental data can determine the underlying equation that explains it. They did an experiment measuring the position of a compound pendulum that's a pendulum connected to a pendulum exhibiting chaotic motion. The program correctly deduced the equations of motion from the system.

What the program didn't do is explain the theory behind the equations instead it just fit the data to the equation. Anyway, you can read more about it here:

https://www.wired.com/2009/04/Newtonai/

In general, we use computers to model physical systems and compare the programs predictions to the actual system. The computer is a tool that allows us to understand complex systems that we couldn't have years before in the age of paper, pencil and sliderule.
 
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rahaverhma said:
I am studying physics. I have concluded that since ancient time, physics have been understood with the help of philosophy,
This has not been true for many centuries. In fact, physics and philosophy have been diametrically opposed at times. For example, in the early 1600s, Galileo put forward the idea that the sun was the center of the solar system, not the earth. The Earth-centric view, that the sun and other planets revolved around the earty, was the dominant philosophical view at the time.

Modern science owes its results to observation and models based on those observations, not on fallacious philosophical arguments.
 
rahaverhma said:
I am studying physics.
welcome?

rahaverhma said:
I have concluded that since ancient time, physics have been understood with the help of philosophy
this stopped being the case since a long time now.

rahaverhma said:
now iI am seeing that the physics is turning into more mathematical
Physics is not turning into more mathematics- its language is mathematics since it tries to describe patterns that we observe in nature.

rahaverhma said:
seems like nature is a matrix composed mathematically.
Whatever... but no, the fact that we use mathematics to describe something doesn't mean that that something is composed of mathematics. First of all, physics use just a small set of mathematics, the rest is either useless to us or doesn't work. For example in mathematics any reasonable statement (roughly speaking) is a proved fact, in physics that's not the case (all proposed theories worked perfectly in mathematics, but some are ruled out because they don't exist). Finally, mathematics is a construct of human civilization [like a tool], a construct can't compose what is there.

rahaverhma said:
With the help of programming, i want to know, can we infer every law of physics?
What do you mean by that question?
With computers you can infer laws outside physics as well, you just create a program to do something crazy/unphysical, such as model the orbit of a planet under a force different to Newton's gravitational force... Giving different inputs will result to the computer giving you different outputs... whether that makes sense or not depends on whether that fits your data or not. In that sense, no they don't infer the laws of physics, they will work out whatever you gave them and will give you the results of what you asked them to do...
Of course computers play far greater role when it comes to large number of data [because they can process it faster than a human can]. Again they are subject to the input. They are also able to learn and understand patterns [but that doesn't happen out of the blue, it's again their ability to try several outcomes and do several comparisons per step] that we give them way faster than we do (but sometimes we can think instead of trying)... for example Artificial Intelligence works on that field.
 
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