Proof involving ##ω(ξ,n)=u(x,y)## - Partial differential equations

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the transformations involved in partial differential equations, specifically focusing on the relationship between the variables \( \omega(\xi, n) \) and \( u(x,y) \). Participants are examining the derivation of certain transforms and the implications of these transformations on the derivatives of the functions involved.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants are attempting to clarify the application of the chain rule for derivatives in the context of the transformations. There are discussions about the correctness of certain assumptions regarding the linearity of the transformations and the nature of the functions involved.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing with various interpretations being explored. Some participants have provided insights into the derivation of derivatives and the structure of the equations, while others are questioning the assumptions made about the functions and their relationships.

Contextual Notes

There is an emphasis on the complexity of the transformations and the need for careful consideration of the derivatives involved. Participants are also reflecting on their understanding and the contributions of others in the thread.

chwala
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Homework Statement
kindly see attached.
Relevant Equations
Partial differential equations
1650259579487.png


I am going through this page again...just out of curiosity, how did they arrive at the given transforms?, ...i think i get it...very confusing...
in general,
##U_{xx} = ξ_{xx} =ξ_{x}ξ_{x}= ξ^2_{x}## . Also we may have
##U_{xy} =ξ_{xy} =ξ_{x}ξ_{y}.## the other transforms follow in a similar manner.
 
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The chain rule for derivatives.
chwala said:
Homework Statement:: kindly see attached.
Relevant Equations:: Partial differential equations

i think i get it...very confusing...
in general,
Uxx=ξxx=ξxξx=ξx2 . Also we may have
Uxy=ξxy=ξxξy. the other transforms follow in a similar manner.
No, this is incorrect. You are missing the derivatives of w. For example:
$$
u_x = w_\xi \xi_x + w_\eta \eta_x
$$
and so on. There seems to be an implicit assumption that the transformation is linear or the higher derivatives would also contain higher derivatives of the new variables.
 
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ok the way i understand it is,
##ω(ξ, n)=u(x,y)##
##ω(ξ, n)=ξ(x,y)+η(x,y)##
##u_x##=##\frac{∂ω}{∂ξ}⋅\frac{∂ξ}{∂x}##+##\frac{∂ω}{∂η}⋅\frac{∂η}{∂x}##
##u_x=ω_ξ⋅ξ_x+ω_η⋅η_x##
 
chwala said:
ok the way i understand it is,
##ω(ξ, n)=u(x,y)##
##ω(ξ, n)=ξ(x,y)+η(x,y)##
##u_x##=##\frac{∂ω}{∂ξ}⋅\frac{∂ξ}{∂x}##+##\frac{∂ω}{∂η}⋅\frac{∂η}{∂x}##
##u_x=ω_ξ⋅ξ_x+ω_η⋅η_x##
No, this is incorret. You do not know that w is a sum of xi and eta. It may be any function.
 
Orodruin said:
No, this is incorret. You do not know that w is a sum of xi and eta. It may be any function.
Lol...let me look at this again...
The correct approach should be, since ##ξ =ξ (x,y)## is a function of ##x## and ##y## and
##η= η(x,y)## being also a function of ##x## and ##y##, then using the transform ##ω(ξ,n)=u(x,y)##, we shall have
##u_x##=##\frac{∂ω}{∂ξ}⋅\frac{∂ξ}{∂x}##+##\frac{∂ω}{∂η}⋅\frac{∂η}{∂x}##
##u_x=ω_ξ⋅ξ_x+ω_η⋅η_x##
 
Last edited:
Quite interesting how they came up with the transformations...its some bit of work. To go straight to the point we have,
##u_x=ξ_x ⋅ω_ξ+η_x⋅ω_η## it follows that,
##u_{xx}=u_x ⋅u_x=(ξ_x ⋅ω_ξ+η_x⋅ω_η)(ξ_x ⋅ω_ξ+η_x⋅ω_η)=ξ^2_x⋅ω_{ξξ}+2ξ_x⋅ η_xω_{ξη}+η^2_x⋅ω_{ηη}##
##u_{xy}=u_x ⋅u_y=(ξ_x ⋅ω_ξ+η_x⋅ω_η)(ξ_y ⋅ω_ξ+η_y⋅ω_η)=ξ_xξ_y ω_{ξξ}+(ξ_x⋅ η_y+ξ_y⋅ η_x)ω_{ξη}+η_xη_yω_{ηη}##
##u_{yy}=u_y ⋅u_y=(ξ_y ⋅ω_ξ+η_y⋅ω_η)(ξ_y ⋅ω_ξ+η_y⋅ω_η)=ξ^2_y⋅ω_{ξξ}+2ξ_y⋅ η_yω_{ξη}+η^2_y⋅ω_{ηη}##

Now what they simply did in finding ##α## for e.g is by putting all coefficients of ##ω_{ξξ}## together, i.e on the pde of the form;

##au_{xx}+2bu_{xy}+cu_{yy}+...##

##α##= ##[aξ^2_x+2bξ_xξ_y+cξ^2_y]ω_{ξξ}##

Coming to the coefficients of ##ω_{ξη}##, we shall be getting ##β## i.e;
##β##=##[2aξ_x⋅ η_x+2b(ξ_x⋅ η_y+ξ_y⋅ η_x)+2cξ_y⋅ η_y]ω_{ξη}##
##β##=##[aξ_x⋅ η_x+b(ξ_x⋅ η_y+ξ_y⋅ η_x)+cξ_y⋅ η_y]ω_{ξη}##
...

the other transforms, ##δ, ϒ ##and ##∈## can be found similarly... i always try to use my own way of thinking ...and also utilizing your input...much appreciated guys...cheers @Orodruin thanks mate. Bingo!
 
Last edited:

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