Proving gradient points in the direction of maximum increase

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the proof that the gradient of a function points in the direction of maximum increase. Participants explore the relationship between gradients, derivatives, and directional derivatives, questioning the adequacy of intuitive explanations versus mathematical proofs.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that the gradient, being the derivatives with respect to all variables, logically points in the direction of maximum increase.
  • Another participant challenges the assertion that the derivative gives the maximum increase of a term, clarifying that it represents the rate of change.
  • A suggestion is made to consider directional derivatives, which involve the dot product between the gradient vector and a direction vector.
  • Participants discuss rewriting the dot product in terms of magnitudes and the cosine of the angle between vectors, questioning how this relates to proving the gradient's directionality.
  • It is proposed to maximize the directional derivative as a function of the angle to find the conditions for maximum increase.
  • There is a consensus that the angle between the gradient vector and the direction vector should be zero for maximum increase, indicating parallel vectors.
  • Some participants note that the proof's adequacy depends on the definition of the gradient, with distinctions made between viewing it as a vector of partial derivatives versus a vector that relates to directional derivatives.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the sufficiency of the intuitive proof and the need for a more rigorous mathematical approach. There is no consensus on whether the proof is adequate, as it hinges on the definitions and interpretations of the gradient.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the need for clarity on the definitions of the gradient and directional derivatives, as well as the potential requirement for the chain rule in certain interpretations.

hivesaeed4
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How do we prove that the gradient points in the direction of the maximum increase? Would it be enough to simply state that the gradient is just the derivates of a function w.r.t all the variables a function depends upon. Since the derivative of a term w.r.t a certain variable gives the maximum increase of that term and since in gradient not only do we account for all possible terms and all the variables upon which a term depends upon but also includes the direction, so it is logical to conclude that the gradient points in the direction of the maximum increase.

Note: I do hope that the above proof is adequate but somehow feel that the proof has to be mathematical. Could someone tell me whether or not my intuition is correct?
 
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"Since the derivative of a term w.r.t a certain variable gives the maximum increase of that term ".
Does it?
 
Sorry. It gives the rate of change of a term.

Then how do I prove that the gradient points in the direction of the maximum increase?
 
Have you learned about directional derivatives yet?
 
Ok:
I just saw that you DO know about directional derivatives, on basis of another thread posted by you!

Now, you now know that the directional derivative is the dot/scalar product between the gradient vector and the direction vector.

Can you rewrite a dot/scalar product between two vectors in another way, a way involving the magintudesof the two vectors?
 
Yes. But that would involve the cos of the angle between the 2 vectors. But how does that prove that the gradient gives the us maximum rate of increase?
 
I haven't done this but as a suggestion.

Make the directional derivative a function of theta and maximize it.
 
hivesaeed4 said:
Yes. But that would involve the cos of the angle between the 2 vectors. But how does that prove that the gradient gives the us maximum rate of increase?
For what angle between the vectors does the cosine function receive its maximum value?
 
zero.
 
  • #10
hivesaeed4 said:
zero.

Indeed!

And, therefore:
What angle between the direction vector and the gradient vector maximizes the dot product between them?
 
  • #11
zero?
 
  • #12
Right!

And, if two vectors have zero angle between them, then they are parallell vectors, meaning that the direction of maximal increase is in the direction of the...?
 
  • #13
In the direction of both vectors.
 
  • #14
So is that the required proof?
 
  • #15
hivesaeed4 said:
In the direction of both vectors.
Yes.
In particular, in the direction of the gradient.
 
  • #16
hivesaeed4 said:
So is that the required proof?

What do you think is lacking/unsatisfactory?
 
  • #17
the answer depends on your definition of the gradient. if you think the gradient is the vector that dots with a direction vector to give the directional derivative, then the previous explanation is all you need.

I you think the gradient is a vector whose entries are the partial derivatives, then you need to make sense out of that a bit more. i.e. you need the chain rule to get the previous statement.
 
  • #18
mathwonk said:
the answer depends on your definition of the gradient. if you think the gradient is the vector that dots with a direction vector to give the directional derivative, then the previous explanation is all you need.

I you think the gradient is a vector whose entries are the partial derivatives, then you need to make sense out of that a bit more. i.e. you need the chain rule to get the previous statement.

That is why I asked OP what, if anything, he found lacking.

However, since he had already posted other threads in which he showed familiarity with the concept of the directional derivative, I assumed he was also familiar with how that is derived.
Therefore, I did not address that point explicitly.
 

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