[Question] About the radio signal for Twin Paradox

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the radio signal communication in the context of the Twin Paradox, specifically referencing an example from the book "Classical Dynamics of Particle and Systems" by Thornton and Marion. Participants are trying to understand the timing and frequency of signals received by Frank after Mary reaches a planet during her journey.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the statement from the book regarding Frank receiving a signal every 3 years for 8 years after Mary sends her last signal, seeking clarification on the timing of these signals.
  • Another participant emphasizes the speed of light and inquires about when the last signal sent by Mary reaches Frank, noting that Mary is closer to the planet than to Frank when she sends the signal.
  • A third participant suggests that spacetime diagrams could help clarify the situation, providing a description of the signals received by both Frank and Mary during their respective journeys.
  • This participant explains that Frank receives a total of 3 and a third signals while Mary is traveling away, and continues to receive additional signals for 8 more years after her turnaround, which leads to a different rate of signal reception.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express confusion and seek clarification on the timing of the signals, indicating that there is no consensus on the explanation provided in the book. Multiple interpretations and models are discussed without resolution.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights the complexity of signal timing in the Twin Paradox scenario, with assumptions about the speed of light and the relative positions of Frank and Mary remaining unresolved. The use of spacetime diagrams is suggested but not universally accepted as a solution.

cxcxcx0505
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There is an example for the radio signal for Twin Paradox from the book "Classical Dynamics of Particle and Systems, Thornton, Marion". Refer "1.jpeg", example 14.5, it said that "However, Frank continues to receive a signal every 3 years for the 8 years it takes the last signal Mary sends when she reaches the planet to travel to Frank". I cannot understand, why there is another 8 years Frank receive signal for every 3 years? Anyone can explain more about this? Thanks.
 

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cxcxcx0505 said:
There is an example for the radio signal for Twin Paradox from the book "Classical Dynamics of Particle and Systems, Thornton, Marion". Refer "1.jpeg", example 14.5, it said that "However, Frank continues to receive a signal every 3 years for the 8 years it takes the last signal Mary sends when she reaches the planet to travel to Frank". I cannot understand, why there is another 8 years Frank receive signal for every 3 years? Anyone can explain more about this? Thanks.

The signal travels at the speed of light. When does the last signal sent by Mary before she reaches the planet get to Frank? She's a lot closer to the planet than to Frank when she sends that signal.
 
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cxcxcx0505 said:
There is an example for the radio signal for Twin Paradox from the book "Classical Dynamics of Particle and Systems, Thornton, Marion". Refer "1.jpeg", example 14.5, it said that "However, Frank continues to receive a signal every 3 years for the 8 years it takes the last signal Mary sends when she reaches the planet to travel to Frank". I cannot understand, why there is another 8 years Frank receive signal for every 3 years? Anyone can explain more about this? Thanks.
I think a couple of spacetime diagrams would clear everything up for you. Here's one showing the radio signals going from Frank (blue) to Mary (Red):

attachment.php?attachmentid=63798&stc=1&d=1384010770.png

As the book says, Mary receives only two signals on her way out but 18 more on her way back (counting the last instantaneous one when she gets back).

Now here's a spacetime diagram showing the radio signals going from Mary (Red) to Frank (blue):

attachment.php?attachmentid=63799&stc=1&d=1384010770.png

As the book says, Frank receives 3 and a third signals during the time that Mary is traveling away (although he has no way of knowing that). He continues to see Mary's signals arriving at the same rate until 8 more years (the length of time the signal sent from Mary at her turnaround takes to get to Frank) and then he starts seeing them come in at three times his own rate for a total of six more in two of his years.

Does it all make sense now?
 

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Thanks all
 

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