News Questioning Obama's Critics: Why the Dislike?

[Ivan Seeking]

So as not to derail other threads, it seemed best to start this one.

For those who do not like Obama, could you state specifically why? I am amazed by, for example, the angry women who think they won't vote for Obama under any conditions. Why? Why the vile and venom? What could he have possibly done to incite such anger?

Same is true for Republicans generally. I understand having reservations about his age and experience, but for these reasons, how can anyone possibly have so much contempt for the man as we hear from individuals and the media?

I am most impressed by people who don't even pay attention to politics, but still hate Obama. I have an uncle who knows about as much politics as I know about basket weaving, but he hates Obama. [course he lives in OC - need more be said?]

I am starting to think that the most vocal opponents are simply racists.

 

[WarPhalange]

Let me get the ball rolling with some honest criticisms:

He doesn't have enough experience in Washington and he's just blindly running into a minefield.

His message of "change" doesn't carry much substance, since he has rarely given any details.

That's all I can think of off the top of my head. Here's some comedy of the West Virgina variety to compensate:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=c-q4MDQ0cDI

There was also one by John Stewart, but F'ing Viacom decided to be a whiny little B**** and take the video down.

 

[Greg Bernhardt]

I generally dislike all politicians. Obama exploits and manipulates just like any other politician. I'm not against voting for him, but I doubt he's the savior for this country.

 

[turbo]

I am starting to think that the most vocal opponents are simply racists.

Some fraction of them are, for sure. I hang out with a bunch of bikers, and one of them (transplant from Brockton MA area) was at my house one day and started spouting off about what a shame it was that so many black people were moving into town. I turned the conversation to something else, and later I printed up an 8x10 photo of my father, wife, sister, nephew and his lovely daughter having a cookout at my house. My nephew is a Navy lifer, and he married a beautiful black woman with a daughter from a previous marriage. I hung that picture on the refrigerator, and the next time he dropped in and went to get a beer, he did a double-take. I said "That's my grand-niece and I love her." He has since (several years now) been on his best behavior, but I'll bet he won't vote for Obama under any circumstances.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

I would also be interested in knowing how many Obama haters watch Fox News, listen to talk radio, or are members of an evangelical church.

 

[turbo]

I generally dislike all politicians. Obama exploits and manipulates just like any other politician. I'm not against voting for him, but I doubt he's the savior for this country.

I'm an independent who shares some values normally attributed to liberals, and some normally attributed to conservatives. I have to hold my nose to vote for any politician, and I choose based on who I think might do the least amount of damage in areas important to me.

 

[Greg Bernhardt]

I would also be interested in knowing how many Obama haters watch Fox News, or listen to talk radio.

I watch FOX news, listen to talk radio, but don't goto church and I'm very much undecided.

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

[of course he lives in OC - need more be said?]

I am starting to think that the most vocal opponents are simply racists.

Thanks for the laugh Ivan.

I can't imagine what people find not to like in Obama. He is young, vigorous, intelligent, and given what's been thrown at him, gracious. If he should win, I believe he will be a great President. Come to think of it, there's only one person in the country that would be better.

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

I would also be interested in knowing how many Obama haters watch Fox News, listen to talk radio, or are members of an evangelical church.

Stop it Ivan.

 

[mgb_phys]

I can't imagine what people find not to like in Obama.

He wants to be president - that's enough to disqualify anyone.

Come to think of it, there's only one person in the country that would be better.

Greg for president?

 

[vociferous]

I do not hate Obama; I simply think he is unlikely to be a good President. I would be okay with seeing him on a ticket as Vice President, and believe that he may even have the potential to be a good President, someday, but today is not the day.

His foreign policy is naive and is likely to lead to almost as many problems as the man he would presume to replace. In my opinion, which I think is well-supported by fact, a decision to withdraw from Iraq before the Democratic government there is strong enough to maintain control, would be almost as bad of a decision as becoming involved in there. And what is Obama's plan, when the government inevitably fails, and a civil war breaks out, with the Sunnis being funded by the Arabs and the Shi'ites by the Iranians, when Al Queda can operate freely among the chaos of civil war? To re-invade Iraq!

As a registered Democrat, this will probably be the only time that I will not vote for the party's presidential nominee.

As for McCain, I respect him, though, like with Obama, I disagree with a big chunk of his platform, especially on domestic issues. Also, as a veteran, I am completely mystified by his decision to oppose increased GI bill benefits. I am certainly not happy with the fact that he will probably become President, though, a balance of power might be beneficial, especially since McCain, unlike Bush, is a moderate who is usually very willing to compromise. His opposition to Webb's improved GI bill is probably going to prevent me from voting for him.

I will probably write-in someone this year. I supported Richardson originally, and later Hillary, after Richardson dropped-out. I will probably write-in Hillary, as I have a feeling a lot of upset Democrats will.

The sparkle of light in this election will be that; whether the President be McCain or Obama, we are virtually guaranteed that they will be a much better Commander-in-Chief than the guy in the Oval Office right now, who is currently the worst President of the 21st century in my book, and I doubt anyone is going to be taking that distinction away during my lifetime.

 

[vociferous]

I would also be interested in knowing how many Obama haters watch Fox News, listen to talk radio, or are members of an evangelical church.

I watch the Daily Show and rarely listen to the radio. One of my parents is Jewish; the other is Liberal Protestant, and I myself am fairly agnostic, but I certainly do not want to see Obama be the next President.

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

[the next president] will be a much better Commander-in-Chief than the guy in the Oval Office right now, who is currently the worst President of the 21st century

Correction, second worst.

 

[russ_watters]

For those who do not like Obama, could you state specifically why? I am amazed by, for example, the angry women who think they won't vote for Obama under any conditions. Why? Why the vile and venom? What could he have possibly done to incite such anger?

Same is true for Republicans generally. I understand having reservations about his age and experience, but for these reasons, how can anyone possibly have so much contempt for the man as we hear from individuals and the media?

I don't have any dislike for him. In fact, up until March I genuinely liked him and had a very strong preference for him over Hillary (yeah, for me that's not saying much).

But, to use your word, I now have some serious reservations about him because:
-He's extremely liberal.
-He's nurtured and surrounded himself in a racist/anti-american culture.
-He's too charismatic.

 

[Gokul43201]

-He's extremely liberal.

Can you explain exactly what you mean by this? I recall you showed appreciation of some of his stances on Iran and/or Pakistan that you thought were quite reasonable and much unlike typical far-left rhetoric.

Edit: This may already be taking the thread off-topic. The OP is more about people that hate Obama than those that disagree with his positions.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Stop it Ivan.

So then we can assume that you do one of the above?

 

[Gokul43201]

-He's nurtured and surrounded himself in a racist/anti-american culture.

Is this about the church that he used to attend?

 

[Ivan Seeking]

I watch FOX news, listen to talk radio...

If you don't mind me asking: Why? Do you consider them to be reliable sources of information?

 

[Greg Bernhardt]

If you don't mind me asking: Why? Do you consider them to be reliable sources of information?

I don't, it's entertainment. With some news on the side.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

I don't, it's entertainment. With some news on the side.

So then you view them as being more inline with The Daily Show, or The Colbert Report?

 

[Greg Bernhardt]

So then you view them as being more inline with The Daily Show, or The Colbert Report?

Fox News is not comedy or parody

 

[Ivan Seeking]

I watch the Daily Show and rarely listen to the radio. One of my parents is Jewish; the other is Liberal Protestant, and I myself am fairly agnostic, but I certainly do not want to see Obama be the next President.

It is perfectly reasonable to prefer one candidate over another. What interests me is the vile and contempt expressed by many people towards Obama. I understand political preference, but I don't understand the hate. I don't understand people who would paint him as a terrorists or whatnot without knowing anything about him.

I never liked Bush, in fact I don't trust any Bush, and I knew without any doubt that his admin would be a national disaster, but over the last eight years, Bush Jr. has earned my contempt. So whereas now I feel rage and contempt, sometimes verging on personal hatred, this would not have been justified in 2000. But I see people who HATE Obama now, and I can see no reason for it.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

I really want Obama to win, but I don't hate McCain. When push comes to shove, I respect the man. I have serious issues with some of his positions, but I respect him. However, I really don't like some of his friends - namely the extreme right - but at the moment, many on the extreme right don't like him much either.

And, yes, they are both politicians, so we can't expect them to be saints. I suspect that it may even be true that Obama cannot walk on water.

 

[Benzoate]

I dislike him because everybody is making him out to be some kind of savior or messiah. For christ sakes he is only a politician. and he has flip flop on issues a couple of times. I get made when they ignore a politician like ron paul who has been consistent on issues he supports or does not support, and he is really a genuine politician and he really cares about the concerns of the people he represents. Not saying that Obama doesn't possesses any integrity but we barely know him. He has not been in office long enough for people to form of him.

 

[mgb_phys]

But I see people who HATE Obama now, and I can see no reason for it.

Surely it couldn't be anything to do with skin colour could it ? Not in such a multicultural society!

 

[russ_watters]

Can you explain exactly what you mean by this?

Jeez, Gokul, how many times are you going to ask this question? I'm not answering it again: you already know the answer.

 

[russ_watters]

Is this about the church that he used to attend?

And his wife. He also said his grandmother was racist, in a racist way, which makes me wonder which one is really the racist.

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

So then we can assume that you do one of the above?

I don't watch TV, I don't listen to radio, and I am Jewish. But what has this to do with your thesis? I don't hate Obama. The reason I laughed is because of the juxtaposition of the following in a single thread:

[course he lives in OC - need more be said?]

I would also be interested in knowing how many Obama haters watch Fox News, listen to talk radio, or are members of an evangelical church.

I am starting to think that the most vocal opponents are simply racists.

It seems that some prejudices are PC while others are not and you know the name of that game.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Orange County is notoriously Republican. Since my uncle doesn't follow the news or have a clue about any facts, he clearly gets his information, and in particular, his attitude, from his friends. So the question is, where do they get their information?

As for the rest, yes, those are certainly sources of hate and misinformation. That point certainly need not be defended.

But I am asking, if it isn't hate radio, or Fox News, or extremist churches, then why the hate?

 

[Ivan Seeking]

I should say that I understand that women are temporarily angry. That is normal when a favorite candidate loses. But still, some that I've seen interviewed are sooooooooo hateful, it really goes beyond politics and is touching something deeper.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

And his wife. He also said his grandmother was racist, in a racist way, which makes me wonder which one is really the racist.

You are suggesting that a guy who is half black, and half white, is a racist?

 

[B. Elliott]

While I don't exactly hate him (pretty strong words), I'm definitely not going to vote for a freshmen senator, completely regardless of the race issue.

 

[Gokul43201]

Jeez, Gokul, how many times are you going to ask this question? I'm not answering it again: you already know the answer.

I know the answer if it is "there was a non-partisan group that called Obama the most liberal senator". I was asking you if there were specific issues that you personally found him too liberal on...but I guess you're not answering that one.

And his wife.

Is this just about the "proud" statement or is there more to it than that? Because, if that's all there is, then McCain saying it's lately tough to be proud of America should make him anti-American too.

He also said his grandmother was racist, in a racist way, which makes me wonder which one is really the racist.

This makes absolutely no sense to me. Here's what he said about his grandmother: "a woman who helped raise me, a woman who sacrificed again and again for me, a woman who loves me as much as she loves anything in this world, but a woman who once confessed her fear of black men who passed by her on the street, and who on more than one occasion has uttered racial or ethnic stereotypes that made me cringe."

How does Obama recounting this make him racist?

 

[Evo]

Okay, let's all remember that emotions run high when it comes to politics.

 

[TheStatutoryApe]

Some fraction of them are, for sure. I hang out with a bunch of bikers, and one of them (transplant from Brockton MA area) was at my house one day and started spouting off about what a shame it was that so many black people were moving into town. I turned the conversation to something else, and later I printed up an 8x10 photo of my father, wife, sister, nephew and his lovely daughter having a cookout at my house. My nephew is a Navy lifer, and he married a beautiful black woman with a daughter from a previous marriage. I hung that picture on the refrigerator, and the next time he dropped in and went to get a beer, he did a double-take. I said "That's my grand-niece and I love her." He has since (several years now) been on his best behavior, but I'll bet he won't vote for Obama under any circumstances.

I've known people like this, and am even related to a few. They seem to be 'racist' by habit. My grandfather always complained about 'wetbacks' and 'niggers' and my 'jap' stepfather but when ever he met someone of another ethnicity he would talk with them and get along with them just fine yet it somehow never occurred to him that maybe his judgements about such people in general were wrong. This has been the pattern with just about every 'racist' I have ever spoken with.

So really I don't think that there are that many people who truly hate Obama because he is black. I was initially worried about the 'keep darkie out' vote but I've come to believe that it is rather impotent without a republican candidate that they really feel they can get behind, that they don't really care that much that Obama is black.

 

[roam]

I don't care about a person's race etc etc... I simply don't vote.

Why vote to support a parliamentarian system I so ferociously dislike?

I would have understood the need to vote during some, say more, class-conscious times but at this point in the US; you're simply keeping the system up and running.

Never settle for the lesser of two evils. Don't even register yourself for the vote, simply ignore it.

That's my opinion, that's what I'd do anyway.

 

[mheslep]

... Here's what he said about his grandmother: "a woman who helped raise me, a woman who sacrificed again and again for me, a woman who loves me as much as she loves anything in this world, but a woman who once confessed her fear of black men who passed by her on the street, and who on more than one occasion has uttered racial or ethnic stereotypes that made me cringe."...

He also used the phrase 'typical white person' referring to her in that line.

 

[vociferous]

It is perfectly reasonable to prefer one candidate over another. What interests me is the vile and contempt expressed by many people towards Obama. I understand political preference, but I don't understand the hate. I don't understand people who would paint him as a terrorists or whatnot without knowing anything about him.

I never liked Bush, in fact I don't trust any Bush, and I knew without any doubt that his admin would be a national disaster, but over the last eight years, Bush Jr. has earned my contempt. So whereas now I feel rage and contempt, sometimes verging on personal hatred, this would not have been justified in 2000. But I see people who HATE Obama now, and I can see no reason for it.

I never liked Bush much, and I think he is a bad President, but I do not understand why people hate him. I also do not understand how people can be so personally judgmental of a person they have never met. I think it is perfectly fine to say, "I think Bush is a bad President," but people will say, "Bush is an jerk," or, "Bush is a moron." Unless you personally know him, I think that is completely unfair, since you really have no personal experience to base that assessment on.

But, it does help explain why people hate Obama. If you do not like someone's policies and stances, the average person is going to start projecting the aforementioned dislike onto their perception of the individual's personality, which is why we get people who absolutely despise and loath those that they have never met.

 

[phyzmatix]

...in fact I don't trust any Bush...

Oh, for sure! It's gotten me into a lot of trouble over the years

 

[D H]

Do I hate him? No. Do I want him as my next president? No.

• He is the slickest of politicians who has somehow convinced the American public into thinking he is something else. He is not something else; he is a politician. A politician with a silver tongue.
  
  
• He is too green (newbie green, not environmental green) and too liberal a politician.
  
  
• The Senate may well be a 58/42 split (counting two independents as Democrats); the House 240/195. I do not like the idea of all the three being under the control of one party.
  
  
• I feel financially and emotionally threatened by Obama. He explicitly made a campaign promise as a kowtow to the teachers union that threatens the field in which I work: human spaceflight. He bolsters my opinion of him every time he speaks about NASA. This is much more than a financial issue; I can always get a job working on things that fly halfway around the world and finish the flight with a rather dramatic flair. This one issue strikes to the very core of who I am.

 

[phyzmatix]

Could someone explain to me what is meant by a "too liberal politician". I noticed that a few people have commented on this perceived aspect of Obama.

Is this someone who won't readily revert to bombing as an answer? Someone who won't rape and pillage economies of developing countries in order to strengthen their own? Someone who might actually sign the Kyoto treaty?

What actions or policies would qualify a politician as "too liberal"?

(PS, I'm not looking for an argument, just some insight into what seems to represent a large part of the American psyche)

 

[B. Elliott]

[*]He is too green (newbie green, not environmental green) and too liberal a politician.

That's my main concern. Not necessarily the liberal aspect, but all in all, why vote for someone who (relatively) has nil experience with government.

 

[AhmedEzz]

I don't hate Obama but I understand why some people might. However, i think that if they 'listen' to him they might like him better and maybe clear some perceptions that they might have. Sure his race and color is an issue, but maybe this can be a positive thing instead of negative one.

 

[Gokul43201]

I do not hate Obama; I simply think he is unlikely to be a good President...His foreign policy is naive and is likely to lead to almost as many problems as the man he would presume to replace. In my opinion, which I think is well-supported by fact, a decision to withdraw from Iraq before the Democratic government there is strong enough to maintain control, would be almost as bad of a decision as becoming involved in there.
...
I will probably write-in Hillary, as I have a feeling a lot of upset Democrats will.

So what exactly was Hillary's position on Iraq, and how did she demonstrate significantly better judgment than Obama?

I dislike him because everybody is making him out to be some kind of savior or messiah.

So you dislike Obama because of the actions of other people?

I never liked Bush much, and I think he is a bad President, but I do not understand why people hate him. I also do not understand how people can be so personally judgmental of a person they have never met. I think it is perfectly fine to say, "I think Bush is a bad President," but people will say, "Bush is an jerk," or, "Bush is a moron." Unless you personally know him, I think that is completely unfair, since you really have no personal experience to base that assessment on.

But, it does help explain why people hate Obama. If you do not like someone's policies and stances, the average person is going to start projecting the aforementioned dislike onto their perception of the individual's personality, which is why we get people who absolutely despise and loath those that they have never met.

The difference: Bush has had 7 years in a position of power where he has been able to directly affect the quality of our lives. Obama has not.

While I don't exactly hate him (pretty strong words), I'm definitely not going to vote for a freshmen senator...

[*]He is too green (newbie green, not environmental green)...

If you really believe a background in constitutional law, a few terms in the Illinois legislature and a couple years in Congress is completely insufficient political experience to be a good President, then you would have voted against one of the greatest American Presidents - Abe Lincoln.

 

[OmCheeto]

Fox News is not comedy or parody

I disagree. When I saw that the National Enquirer was the source of their story one day, I laughed so hard, I almost pissed myself.

Go Obama!

ps. But I don't hate the other candidate. I think either will make a good president, regardless of the nonsense that comes out of their mouths.

 

[Astronuc]

Whoever become President is going to face constraints on the budget, unless that allows the government to continue massive deficit spending.

As for NASA, apparently none of the candidates (ostensibly including McCain) mention it, with the possible exception of Clinton.

Kaufman wrote in the Post that, “Except for Clinton’s, none of the official campaign Web sites appears to mention NASA or human space exploration specifically.” That’s still the case, and it shouldn’t be. Clinton made a smart move when she used the fiftieth anniversary of the Sputnik satellite launch this fall to announce that she would end the Republican “war on science.” Among other things, the New York senator said that she supports continuing manned space exploration and, seemingly, the Constellation program.

http://www.cjr.org/campaign_desk/obamas_nasa_plan_gets_little_p.php

Kaufman's article - http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/11/22/AR2007112201359.html

When asked about their candidates' positions on the moon-Mars project, a spokeswoman for Sen. John McCain (Ariz.) did not respond, . . . .

A comparison of NASA and space exploration policies at Popular Mechanics
http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/air_space/4260504.html



On a broader note, I certainly think negative campaigning with the trend of casting aspersions on one's opponent(s) has had a detrimental affect on US politics and civil discourse. Rather than an objective assessment, it seems some (perhaps many) folks give into emotions and subjective criticism based on innuendo and hearsay. I would hope the PF community strives to be beyond that.

 

[B. Elliott]

If you really believe a background in constitutional law, a few terms in the Illinois legislature and a couple years in Congress is completely insufficient political experience to be a good President, then you would have voted against one of the greatest American Presidents - Abe Lincoln.

I do believe it is insufficient. Fully. Abraham Lincoln also ran for president over 140 years ago which has no resemblance even the slightest to our current economic situations. Different times entirely. If I was around the time that Lincoln was running for president (unknowing of what the future held) I wouldn't have voted for him. And as far as him being one of the greatest American Presidents, that's something I don't agree with considering that my mother is a Civil War historian. But that's a discussion beyond the scope of this topic.

Just because someone can speak with the utmost charisma, doesn't make him a good leader. Adolf Hitler was an excellent speaker.

 

[seycyrus]

I disagree. When I saw that the National Enquirer was the source of their story one day, I laughed so hard, I almost pissed myself.

In the current events segment of many news channels, (CNN, MSNBC,NBC, FOX), the story often refers to allusions made by tabloids.

The fact is that members of both Obama's and Hilary's campaigns were on FOX and lauded them for their unbiased reporting.

The fact that people choose to turn their filters on/off due to what channel they might be watching is ludicrous.

Lots of people had a great laugh due to the fact that the "microwaving popcorn with a cell phone" story was mentioned on FOX, but no one brought up the fact that it was also brought up on CNN...

I remember watching "Judge Dredd" (I think) and a secondary character referred to "The Great Burger Wars"

That ain't nuthin compared to what will happen during "The News Channel Holocaust"!

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

He is too green

The bigots say he is too black. The conservatives say he is too red. The Neocons say he is too yellow. The optimists say he is too blue. And you say he is too green. Did the Rainbow Coalition say he is too white? Only Cindy Lauper knows for sure.

 

[turbo]

I do believe it is insufficient. Fully. Abraham Lincoln also ran for president over 140 years ago which has no resemblance even the slightest to our current economic situations. Different times entirely. If I was around the time that Lincoln was running for president (unknowing of what the future held) I wouldn't have voted for him. And as far as him being one of the greatest American Presidents, that's something I don't agree with considering that my mother is a Civil War historian. But that's a discussion beyond the scope of this topic.

Just because someone can speak with the utmost charisma, doesn't make him a good leader. Adolf Hitler was an excellent speaker.

There are parallels, though, that bear consideration. The Republican party was emerging in power, and Lincoln was handed a terrible mess left behind by Buchanan, whose policies had laid the foundation for the secession of the South. Lincoln made some mistakes, including relying too heavily on ineffectual generals like McClellan, who dithered away precious time while the South built their military strength. The next president will have his hands full trying to disengage peacefully from Iraq, while trying to take down Al Qaeda and the de-fang the Taliban.

As for experience - no single person can do all the jobs of the administration - the trick is to get (and heed) good advice from people with in-depth knowledge of the problems and opportunities at hand, and delegate responsibility wisely, and demand accountability and follow-up.