Questions about lights contradicting properties

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    Lights Properties
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the properties of light, particularly photons, and the behavior of electrons in higher energy orbits. Participants explore concepts related to mass, energy, and the implications of these properties on the speed of light and atomic behavior.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the interchangeability of energy and mass, suggesting that if photons possess energy, they must also have mass, which contradicts their ability to travel at the speed of light.
  • Another participant clarifies that objects with rest mass cannot reach the speed of light and suggests that dynamic mass is synonymous with energy.
  • A participant expresses confusion about how an object can have energy/mass due to kinetic energy while at rest, arguing that if something exists, it must have substance and therefore mass.
  • There is a discussion about the potential energy of electrons in higher orbits, with one participant seeking a deeper understanding of how an energized electron can hold more energy without exceeding the speed of light.
  • Speculative ideas are presented regarding the possibility of electrons increasing in charge and size when energized, and the notion that photons might be a mechanism to reset energies and speeds.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the relationship between energy, mass, and the speed of light. There is no consensus on the explanations for the behavior of photons and electrons, and the discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express misunderstandings of established concepts, and there are references to common knowledge without deeper exploration. The discussion includes speculative ideas that are not aligned with conventional scientific understanding.

Pyro Ninja
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Hi there, I've got a few questions about light that I'm hoping someone can help me with.

1. If the properties of energy and mass are interchangeable, then if some particle or wave possesses charge or energy then it must also have mass. Whether a photon is acting as a particle or a wave it still posseses energy, thus mass, and so should not be able to attain a speed of c. I have read an answer to a similar question where the answer stated that possesing mass is not a prequisite to physical existence, but I disagree with that statement, for to exist, a force must possesses a physical pressence in the form of an energy in order to cause an affect upon other matter.
How can you explain this contradiction of light's properties?
Could it be that the size/mass and properties of the photon are at an exact, compramising point and state required for matter and the speed of c to be able to co exist as one?

2. What does it mean when an electron is said to move to a higher energy orbit? (Unfortunately I'm not a mathmatition, I'm good with processes, but I need answers in lamens terms). I've read, that, as the atom is energised, eg elctricity in a light bulb etc. the electron becomes temporarily energised, and so moves to a higher energy orbit. Now it can't sustain that orbit, and when it drops back to its preferable, lower energy orbit, that difference in energy is released in the form of a packet of energy; a photon.
What I want to know, is what is physically happening when the electron becomes energised and moves to a higher energy orbit?
How is the electron able to possesses more energy? for it can't move any faster as it is already aproaching the speed of c anyway. Does the Electron therefore possesses a greater charge and increase its size while it is said to move to a higher energy orbit?

Could it be possible, that as the electron becomes energised, it does infact move at an increased speed, which would cause it to move at, or faster than the speed of c. Perhaps in order to prevent this 'breaking of the rules' The paradox created by it achieving what it should be un able to, is what creates the photon, in order to reset the energys and speeds back down to what they should be. This last point is meerly the entertaining of a fancy of mine. Although there is logic behind this fancy, my post is already too long, and adding this reasoning right now would make it a bit too sizeable.
 
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Pyro Ninja said:
Whether a photon is acting as a particle or a wave it still posseses energy, thus mass, and so should not be able to attain a speed of c.
Objects with rest mass cannot reach c. The dynamic mass you mean is just a different word for energy.
Pyro Ninja said:
How is the electron able to possesses more energy?
Potential energy is greater for higher orbits.
 
A.T. said:
Objects with rest mass cannot reach c.

How can an object have an energy/mass due to its kinetic energy/acceleration, but not when it is at rest? This makes no sense to me, for if an object exists in physical actuallity, then it must have substance, for if it didn't then it would have no prescence, and thus could not be detected. And if it has substance, even if you refer to it as a 'packet of energy' or what ever, it must have mass or it cannot exist.

A.T. said:
Potential energy is greater for higher orbits.

Unfortunately this quote answers nothing. It meerly states common knowledge.
How is the 'energised electron' able to hold more energy? When it is already approaching the speed of c and so cannot gain any kinetic energy. Does it increase its charge and size? If so, how does it do this? What physically takes place?
If anyone can give me a more substantial answer, I would really appreciate it, thanks
 
Last edited:
Please review the forum guidelines regarding personal theories: they aren't allowed here.

You're wasting your time, anyway, trying to come up with your own theory - most of what you said there is just misunderstandings of what is already known. You'd be much better off buying a used textbook and learning the real science of the issue rather than just idly speculating about it.

Thread locked.
 

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