Recovering function from its gradient

  • Thread starter Thread starter Nero26
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Function Gradient
Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around recovering a scalar function ∅ from its gradient, given a vector field F. The participants explore the relationship between the components of F and the partial derivatives of ∅, particularly focusing on the integration process and the implications of using different notations for partial derivatives.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the integration of partial derivatives to recover the function ∅ and question the correct notation for partial derivatives. There is also a transition to a new problem involving finding a vector field from its curl, prompting inquiries about the formulation of partial differential equations (PDEs) for each component of the vector field.

Discussion Status

The discussion is active, with participants providing guidance on notation and integration steps. There is an acknowledgment of the need to derive PDEs for the new problem, indicating a productive exploration of the topic without reaching a consensus on the methods.

Contextual Notes

Participants are navigating the complexities of notation in partial derivatives and the implications for solving the equations. The transition to a new problem introduces additional variables and considerations, highlighting the ongoing nature of the inquiry.

Nero26
Messages
21
Reaction score
1
Hi all,
I've to recover a function ∅ such that F=∇∅,F=3x^2y i +(x^3+2yz)j+y^2k.
So, ∂∅/∂x=3x^2y, Integrating w.r.t. x
∅=x^3y+f(y,z) ,Assuming there may be function of y and z.----------1
∴∂∅/∂y=x^3+f'(y,z)
now, ∂∅/∂y=(x^3+2yz)=x^3+f'(y,z)
∴f'(y,z)=2yz
To find ∅ from 1 I've to find f(y,z).
My problem is how to get f(y,z) from f'(y,z),should I integrate it w.r.t. y or z?
Thanks for your help.
 
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
Nero26 said:
Hi all,
I've to recover a function ∅ such that F=∇∅,F=3x^2y i +(x^3+2yz)j+y^2k.
So, ∂∅/∂x=3x^2y, Integrating w.r.t. x
∅=x^3y+f(y,z)

OK so far

,Assuming there may be function of y and z.----------1
∴∂∅/∂y=x^3+f'(y,z)
now, ∂∅/∂y=(x^3+2yz)=x^3+f'(y,z)
∴f'(y,z)=2yz


You shouldn't use ' for a partial derivative. What you have is ##\phi_y = x^3 +f_y(y,z)## which must equal ##x^3+2yz##.
To find ∅ from 1 I've to find f(y,z).
My problem is how to get f(y,z) from f'(y,z),should I integrate it w.r.t. y or z?
Thanks for your help.

And that illustrates perfectly why you should use the partial symbol instead of the '. So what you actually have to solve at this step is ##f_y(y,z) = 2yz##. Can you finish it From there?
 
Last edited:
LCKurtz said:
OK so far




You shouldn't use ' for a partial derivative. What you have is ##\phi_y = x^3 +f_y(y,z)## which must equal ##x^3+2yz##.


And that illustrates perfectly why you should use the partial symbol instead of the '. So what you actually have to solve at this step is ##f_y(y,z) = 2yz##. Can you finish it From there?

Thanks a lot for your help.
Now I got it, I've to integrate it w.r.t. y to get ##f_y(y,z)## to get f(y,z),Right?
Btw, I've got a new problem,F=i(x3z-2xyz)+j(xy-3x2yz)+k(yz2-zx) is a solenoidal vector field.I've to find a V such that F=∇XV
So,now it comes to find a vector field from its curl.How can I find it? In my book only from gradient was explained but not from curl :cry: So please help me out.
 
Don't know if there's a smarter way, but the obvious is to write out three PDEs, one for each component of F.
 
haruspex said:
Don't know if there's a smarter way, but the obvious is to write out three PDEs, one for each component of F.
Sorry,I exactly didn't get you.
I think PDE=partial differential equations.If so with respect to which variable x,y,or z or all of them?
Please say something more,
Thanks a lot for your help.
 
Nero26 said:
Sorry,I exactly didn't get you.
I think PDE=partial differential equations.
Yes. You know the definition of and of cross-product, so given the vector that results, F, you can write down three PDEs, one for each component of ∇XV. That gives you three equations involving ∂V/∂x etc.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
2K
Replies
8
Views
2K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
4K
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
2K
  • · Replies 26 ·
Replies
26
Views
3K
  • · Replies 17 ·
Replies
17
Views
4K
Replies
10
Views
1K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K