Solving Equation 15.43 Line 2 to 3 in Tevian Dray's Differential Forms

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the transition between lines 2 and 3 of equation 15.43 in Tevian Dray's "Differential Forms." Participants are exploring the implications of the exterior derivative and the properties of forms, specifically focusing on the relationships between one-forms and two-forms, as well as the application of the wedge product and its associated signs.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that the equality is implied in the transition from line 2 to line 3 of the equation, expressing a desire for clarification on their misunderstanding.
  • Another participant confirms that if α is a one-form, then dα is a two-form, and discusses the sign change in the wedge product, specifically stating that dα ∧ β = β ∧ dα.
  • A later reply emphasizes the general rule for the wedge product of p-forms and q-forms, providing the formula and confirming the sign for the specific case discussed.
  • One participant introduces a related issue regarding the exterior derivative of the product of forms, noting the potential for a minus sign when applying the product rule.
  • Another participant acknowledges the clarification regarding the exterior derivative and expresses appreciation for the insight gained from the discussion.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants appear to agree on the properties of the exterior derivative and the wedge product, but there are indications of uncertainty regarding the specific application in the context of the equation. The discussion includes multiple viewpoints and clarifications, suggesting that some aspects remain unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants express varying levels of understanding and clarity, indicating that some assumptions may not be fully articulated. The discussion also highlights the complexity of applying the product rule in the context of differential forms.

gnnmartin
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In 15.43 he implies dα ∧ β = β ∧ dα where α,β are one forms.
I expected dα ∧ β = −β ∧ dα. Am I misreading the text, or have I simply lost the plot?
The equality is implied in the move from equation 15.43 line 2 to line 3.

I do find Dray's book is admirably clear and absolutely says something I wish to understand, but my 78 year old brain has difficulty. However, in this case I can be precise about where I fail to follow.

Oh! I find after all, writing this has enabled me to see my mistake, but I'll post the question all the same so that some kind person can confirm where I went wrong. If α is a one form, dα is a two form, so dα ∧ β = −−β ∧ dα = β ∧ dα.
 
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Note that ##d\alpha## is a 2-form if ##\alpha## is a 1-form. In general, if ##\omega## and ##\eta## are ##p##- and ##q##-forms, respectively, then
$$
\omega\wedge\eta = (-1)^{p q} \eta \wedge\omega.
$$

Here you have ##p=2## and ##q=1## so ##(-1)^{p q} = (-1)^2 = +1##.

gnnmartin said:
Oh! I find after all, writing this has enabled me to see my mistake, but I'll post the question all the same so that some kind person can confirm where I went wrong. If α is a one form, dα is a two form, so dα ∧ β = −−β ∧ dα = β ∧ dα.
Indeed.
 
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Thanks.
 
Comment regarding a somewhat different but related issue that someone reading this in the future might also encounter:

Note that the exterior derivative of the product ##\omega \wedge \eta## also has a potential minus sign popping up when applying the product rule:
$$
d(\omega\wedge\eta) = (d\omega) \wedge \eta + (-1)^p \omega \wedge d\eta
$$
 
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Orodruin said:
Comment regarding a somewhat different but related issue that someone reading this in the future might also encounter:

Note that the exterior derivative of the product ##\omega \wedge \eta## also has a potential minus sign popping up when applying the product rule:
$$
d(\omega\wedge\eta) = (d\omega) \wedge \eta + (-1)^p \omega \wedge d\eta
$$
Thanks, yes, it was not immediately obvious to me, but given the prompt I can see it.
 

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