Special Relativity Paradox "Terrorist and Spaceship"

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around a thought experiment involving special relativity, specifically a scenario where a spaceship traveling at 0.5c receives a warning signal about a bomb planted on Earth. Participants explore the implications of simultaneity, distance measurements, and the Lorentz transformations in different frames of reference.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant calculates the time elapsed on the ship's clock and questions the accuracy of a diagram representing the situation from the ship's frame of reference.
  • Another participant highlights the importance of the relativity of simultaneity, indicating that the timing of the warning signal differs in the ship's frame.
  • Several participants emphasize the need to specify the frame of reference when discussing distances and events in relativity scenarios.
  • A suggestion is made to apply Lorentz transformations to determine the coordinates of events in the different frames, with specific values provided for the signal's transmission and reception.
  • There is a discussion about the perceived distance of the warning signal from the ship's perspective, with conflicting views on the correct measurement.
  • One participant summarizes the discussion, thanking others for their contributions and assistance.
  • A mathematical note is introduced regarding the Doppler factor for the given speed, linking it to the timing of the signal reception.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the distances and timings of events in the various frames of reference, indicating that multiple competing interpretations remain unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the need for clarity regarding the frame of reference when discussing distances and events, as well as the potential for errors in initial diagrams and calculations.

sergiokapone
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The ship left Earth at a speed of 0.5c . When the distance between the ship and Earth was 0.25 light year, a terrorist was caught on Earth who said that he had planted a bomb at the time of departure and activated it for 10 months. At that moment, a warning signal was sent from Earth.

The diagram looks like this

1690997530415.png


According to the ship's clock, $$\tau = 12\cdot \sqrt{1- \left(\frac12\right)^2} \approx 10.4 $$months have passed, so the ship must explode.

The question is this. What would the diagram look like in the ship's frame of reference? The ship is already stationary and the earth is traveling at -0.5c.

1690997742061.png

This diagram contains an error, according to the previous diagram, there should be 10.4 months, but this one shows 9 months. I must have forgotten something and forgot to account for it. How to draw the diagram correctly from the ship's point of view?
 
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sergiokapone said:
I must have forgotten something and forgot to account for it.
It is almost always the relativity of simultaneity. The message is not sent at ##t=6## in the ship frame.
 
sergiokapone said:
When the distance between the ship and Earth was 0.25 light months
"When" according to what frame? Distance according to what frame? These things always need to be specified in an relativity scenario.
 
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Dale said:
It is almost always the relativity of simultaneity. The message is not sent at ##t=6## in the ship frame.
Yes, I understand that by the ship's clock it will not be ##6## months, but what about the distance, it will be ##3## light months from the ship's point of view (or not?). What will the diagram look like?
 
PeterDonis said:
"When" according to what frame? Distance according to what frame? These things always need to be specified in an relativity scenario.
According to Earth. That's where my gap is, relative to the ship, would that be a different distance?
 
Plug in the Lorentz transforms. The signal is sent at ##x=0, t=6## (assuming your diagram is correct and the description should say 0.25 light years) and received at ##x=6, t=12##. Lorentz transform those events. Job done.
 
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sergiokapone said:
Yes, I understand that by the ship's clock it will not be ##6## months, but what about the distance, it will be ##3## light months from the ship's point of view (or not?). What will the diagram look like?
It will not be 3 light-months. It will be ##0.5 t \mathrm{\ light months}## where ##t## is the time that it is sent in the ship's frame.
 
sergiokapone said:
Yes, I understand that by the ship's clock it will not be ##6## months, but what about the distance, it will be ##3## light months from the ship's point of view (or not?). What will the diagram look like?
What are the coordinates of the "message sent" event , using the frame in which the earth is at rest?
(Your first diagram shows them as ##x=0## and ##t=6##, not consistent with the text above it).

Use the Lorentz transformations to find the coordinates of that event using the frame in which the ship is at rest. That will give you the correct starting point for the line indicating the path of the warning message in the second disgram, the one drawn using coordinates n which the ship is at rest.
 
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sergiokapone said:
relative to the ship, would that be a different distance?
Yes. But the event of the warning being sent from Earth will also occur at a different time in the ship's frame, as has already been pointed out.
 
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I'll summarize. Thank you to everyone who responded and helped me.

Earth frame
Spaceship's Frame
 
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  • #11
1691166356228.png
 
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  • #12
Note that the Doppler factor for v/c=0.5 is k=\sqrt{\frac {1+v/c}{1-v/c}}=\sqrt{3}, which is about 10.39/6.

By the way, once you know 10.39 is the wristwatch time of the receiver when the signal received,
in your receiver frame, you can draw a past-directed light signal from 10.39 on the receiver worldline.. and locate the intersection event with the source worldline.
 

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