Square an inequality if both sides are positive

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the manipulation of inequalities, specifically whether squaring or cubing both sides of an inequality is valid when both sides are positive. Participants explore the implications of these operations and the conditions under which they hold true.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant asserts that squaring an inequality is valid if both sides are positive and questions whether cubing is similarly valid.
  • Another participant explains that the validity of manipulating inequalities depends on whether the function applied is increasing or decreasing, noting that the function f(x)=x^2 is increasing for positive numbers.
  • It is proposed that since f(x)=x^3 is increasing everywhere, cubing both sides of an inequality is permissible when both sides are positive.
  • A participant presents two different approaches to an inequality involving positive numbers related by a specific equation, questioning why the results differ.
  • Another participant clarifies that the differences arise from the manipulations performed, indicating that the first approach does not utilize the specific relationship between the variables, while the second does.
  • A further contribution illustrates the transitive property of inequalities through multiplication and suggests that similar reasoning can be applied to cubes.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that squaring and cubing inequalities can be valid under certain conditions, particularly when both sides are positive. However, there is no consensus on the implications of different manipulations of inequalities, as demonstrated by the differing results in the presented examples.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights the importance of the conditions under which inequalities are manipulated, particularly the assumptions about the positivity of the variables involved and the specific relationships between them.

zorro
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I know that we can square an inequality if both sides are positive.
But can we cube an inequality provided both the sides are positive?
If no then why?
 
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The question of whether you can perform an operation on both sides of an inequality is one of whether the function is increasing or decreasing. the function f(x)=x2 is not increasing (when x is negative), so will not preserve order.

On the other hand, for just the positive set of numbers, f(x)=x2 is increasing, so f(x)<f(y) if and only if x<y.

The function f(x)=x3 is increasing everywhere, so x3<y3 if and only if x<y This means that you can cube both sides of an inequality whenever you want
 


Suppose a<c and b<c (all are positive)
and a,b,c are related by the equation a^2 + b^2 =c^2
I proceeded in 2 ways-
1) a^3 < c^3
and b^3 <c^3
i.e. (a^3 + b^3 )/2 < c^3

2) a^3=a.a^2<c.a^2
similarly b.b^2<c.b^2
i.e. a^3 + b^3 < c^3 (a^2 + b^2=c^2)

why are 1 and 2 different?
 


1 and 2 are different because you did different things. When you manipulate an inequality you aren't guaranteed to get the best possible new inequality; in this case the first one just happens to be worse than the second one.

Notice you didn't use the fact about the sum of a and b squared when doing (1), which means that it's true for any choices of a, b and c, whereas in (2) a, b and c need to satisfy a2+b2=c2
 


If 0< x< y, then, multiplying both sides by the positive number x, [itex]0< x^2< xy[/itex]. Multiplying 0< x< y by the positive number y, [itex]0< xy< y^2[/itex]. Since "<" is "transitive", [itex]0< x^2< xy< y^2[/itex] so [itex]x^2< y^2[/itex].

Do that again to get cubes.
 

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