Trying to understand Levi-Civita Symbol and notation

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around understanding the Levi-Civita symbol, its notation, and its application in summations involving indices. Participants explore its values, the implications of using multiple indices, and how to interpret expressions involving the symbol.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion about the Levi-Civita symbol, noting its values of -1, 1, and 0, and questions how it can be involved in summations with additional indices like m and n.
  • Another participant clarifies that the summation is for fixed values of j, k, m, and n, indicating that the summation does not involve these indices as variables.
  • A participant seeks to understand the value of the Levi-Civita symbol in relation to the indices j and k, questioning if they are necessary to determine its value.
  • Another participant points out that if j and k are provided, their values are known, suggesting that this resolves some of the confusion regarding the symbol's application.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the understanding of the Levi-Civita symbol, as there are varying levels of clarity and confusion expressed regarding its notation and application.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the discussion regarding the assumptions about the indices and the specific context in which the Levi-Civita symbol is applied, which may affect the interpretation of the expressions discussed.

Werbel22
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Hello,

I am having a little difficulty understanding what exactly the Levi-Civita symbol is about.

In the past I believed that it was equal to 1, -1 and 0, depending on the number of permutations of i,j,k. I had just accepted that to be the extent of it.

However, now I am seeing things like summations with i,j,k mentioned as WELL as other letters, for example m and n in the link below. I tried reading online about it to understand what exactly it is, especially here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Levi-Civita_symbol#Relation_to_Kronecker_delta

How can something that is the value of -1, 1 or 0 be written as a sum, with i=1 up to 3 as written in the link, without any mention of the values of j or k? Whenever I see summation, I think substitute i=1 first, then add with i=2, then add the value with i=3, and that's the answer. But if it's E_ijk E_imn, if I sub into the 'contracted epsilon identity' as shown on wikipedia I get

E_1jk E_1mn + E2jk E_2mn + E3jk E_3mn

How do I know what to do with the levi-civita symbol if I don't know what to with all these other letters?

What does this expression even mean? :S

Sorry for my lack of knowledge here, I haven't had much experience ever using it and I'm worried I'll fall behind in class if I don't get this cleared up.

Thanks!
 
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Werbel22 said:
… However, now I am seeing things like summations with i,j,k mentioned as WELL as other letters, for example m and n in the link below. I tried reading online about it to understand what exactly it is, especially here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Levi-Civita_symbol#Relation_to_Kronecker_delta

How can something that is the value of -1, 1 or 0 be written as a sum, with i=1 up to 3 as written in the link, without any mention of the values of j or k? Whenever I see summation, I think substitute i=1 first, then add with i=2, then add the value with i=3, and that's the answer. …

Hello Werbel22! :smile:

i=1 up to 3 is only for three dimensions.

For the generalisation to n dimensions, i = 1 to n.

The product of two Levi-Civita symbols in n dimensions is given later on that page, as a determinant.

The ∑ with i=1 up to 3 as written in the link is for fixed values of j k m and n (so the RHS is a function of j k m and n) … there's no summing over j and k because they're fixed. :wink:
 
So then what is the value of the levi-civita symbol then? I only know it to be -1, 1, 0, and I thought you need to know about j and k as well to find it's value?
 
?? :confused: if j and k are given, then you do know their values.
 

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