Using Stoke's theorem on an off-centre sphere

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around applying Stokes' theorem to a problem involving an off-centre sphere and a specific vector field. Participants are examining the relationship between line integrals and surface integrals in this context.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to compute the curl of a vector field and project the surface onto the x-y plane. Some participants question the necessity of certain steps in finding the unit normal to a plane and suggest that a simpler approach may be valid.

Discussion Status

Participants are exploring various interpretations of the problem, particularly regarding the choice of surface for the application of Stokes' theorem. Some guidance has been offered regarding the equivalence of surface integrals over different surfaces bounded by the same curve.

Contextual Notes

There are indications of confusion regarding the setup of the problem, particularly about the nature of the surface and its representation in terms of x and y coordinates. Additionally, there is a mention of a missing factor in the original poster's calculations.

Morbidly_Green
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Homework Statement



Screen Shot 2018-06-03 at 15.15.05.png

Homework Equations


Stokes theorem
$$\int_C \textbf{F} . \textbf{dr} = \int_S \nabla \times \textbf{F} . \textbf{ds}$$

The Attempt at a Solution


IMG_0114.JPG


I have the answer to the problem but mine is missing a factor of$$\sqrt 2 $$ I can't seem to find my error
 

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Please write out your attempt instead of attaching an image of it. I cannot read what is in your image.
 
Apologies for that:

F= (y,z,x)
curl F = (-1,-1,-1)

Projecting the surface on the x-y plane:

Take ##\Phi = z- \sqrt{2b(x+y)-x^2 -y^2} = 0## from the equation of the surface to find the normal n. Then $$\textbf{n} = \dfrac{\nabla\Phi}{|\nabla\Phi|} = \dfrac{\left(\dfrac{x-b}{\sqrt{2b(x+y)-x^2 -y^2}} , \dfrac{y-b}{\sqrt{2b(x+y)-x^2 -y^2}},1\right)}{\dfrac{\sqrt{2}b}{\sqrt{2b(x+y)-x^2 -y^2}}}$$

Now ##ds = \dfrac{dx dy}{\textbf{n}.\textbf{k}} = \dfrac{\sqrt{2}b}{\sqrt{2b(x+y)-x^2 -y^2}} dxdy ##

$$\therefore \int_{S}\nabla \times \textbf{F}.\textbf{ds} = -\int\int dxdy = -\int^{2\pi}_{0}\int^{\sqrt{2}b}_{0} r \ dr d\theta = -2\pi b^2$$

Where for the change to polar coordinates was taken as ##x=rcos\theta +b , y=rsin\theta +b##
 
The plane ##x + y +0z= 2b## has unit normal ##\hat n = \frac 1 {\sqrt 2}\langle 1,1,0\rangle## in the correct direction. So $$
\oint_C \vec F\cdot dr = \iint_S \langle -1,-1,-1\rangle \cdot \frac 1 {\sqrt 2}\langle 1,1,0\rangle ~dS
=-\frac 2 {\sqrt 2} \cdot \text{Area of circle}$$
You don't need to jump through all those hoops to get the unit normal to a plane nor work the area integral.
Edit, added: What's worse, the plane is vertical and can't be expressed as a function of ##x## and ##y##.
 
LCKurtz said:
The plane ##x + y +0z= 2b## has unit normal ##\hat n = \frac 1 {\sqrt 2}\langle 1,1,0\rangle## in the correct direction. So $$
\oint_C \vec F\cdot dr = \iint_S \langle -1,-1,-1\rangle \cdot \frac 1 {\sqrt 2}\langle 1,1,0\rangle ~dS
=-\frac 2 {\sqrt 2} \cdot \text{Area of circle}$$
You don't need to jump through all those hoops to get the unit normal to a plane nor work the area integral.
Edit, added: What's worse, the plane is vertical and can't be expressed as a function of ##x## and ##y##.

So this is taking the surface to be the circle ? Thats much simpler then, thanks!
 
Morbidly_Green said:
So this is taking the surface to be the circle ? Thats much simpler then, thanks!
Yes. It doesn't matter what surface is bounded by the curve. No matter which surface you use, its surface integral is equal to the same ##\int_C \vec F\cdot dr##, so they are all equal. So you can evaluate the surface integral over simplest such surface, which is the planar disk.
 

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