Verifying the flux transport theorem

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around verifying the flux transport theorem using a uniformly expanding hemisphere defined by the equation \(x^2+y^2+z^2=(vt)^2\) for \(z \ge 0\). Participants are exploring the mathematical formulation and integration techniques relevant to surface integrals in spherical coordinates.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to calculate the surface integral and expresses uncertainty regarding the form of the surface element \(d\textbf{S}\) in spherical coordinates. They question how to set the bounds for integration and the interpretation of the radius \(r\) in this context.
  • Some participants provide links to resources on spherical coordinates and suggest intuitive approaches to understanding the surface element, while others clarify the expression for \(dS\) and discuss parametrization of the surface.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants providing insights and resources to aid understanding. There is a focus on interpreting the surface element and parametrizing the surface for integration, indicating a collaborative effort to clarify these concepts.

Contextual Notes

Participants are navigating the complexities of spherical coordinates and surface integrals, with specific attention to the changing bounds and the interpretation of vector elements in this framework. There is an acknowledgment of the need for clarity in the mathematical expressions involved.

Zack K
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Homework Statement
Let ##S_t## be a uniformly expanding hemisphere described by ##x^2+y^2+z^2=(vt)^2, (z\ge0)##
Verify the flux transport theorem in this case
Relevant Equations
flux transport theorem: $$\frac{d\phi}{dt} =\int\int_{S_t}\left(\frac{\partial \textbf{F}}{\partial t} + (\nabla \cdot\textbf{F})\textbf{v} + \nabla \times(\textbf{F}\times\textbf{v})\right)\cdot d\textbf{S}$$ where ##\textbf{F}(\textbf{R},t)=\textbf{R}t=(xt,yt,zt)## (I think?)
Let ##S_t## be a uniformly expanding hemisphere described by ##x^2+y^2+z^2=(vt)^2, (z\ge0)##

I assume by verify they just want me to calculate this for the surface. I guess that ##\textbf{v}=(x/t,y/t,z/t)## because ##v=\frac{\sqrt{x^2+y^2+z^2}}{t}##. The three terms in the parentheses evaluate quite nicely. We end up getting $$2\int\int_{S_t}(x,y,z)\cdot d\textbf{S}$$ Here is where I don't understand. So I am thinking to change to spherical coordinates, but I do not know what the ##d\textbf{S}## vector looks like in spherical coordinates. I also don't know what to integrate over. Don't we have 3 bounds that are changing? ##\theta, \phi## and ##r##? And what would the upper bound of r even look like? Would it be ##rt##?
 
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archaic said:
You can actually figure the surface element intuitively. Imagine ##\theta## changing by ##d\theta##, that gives you ##dl_1=rd\theta##, then imagine ##\varphi## changing by ##d\varphi##, that gives you ##dl_2=(r\sin\theta)d\varphi##. We then have ##|d\vec S|=dl_1\times dl_2##.
Thinking infinitesimally, the lengths are too small to be considered arcs, so we think of them as straight lines.
Kugelkoord-lokale-Basis-s.svg.png
 
I should have clarified. I know ##dS= r^2sin\theta d\theta d\phi##. I want to be able to "interpret" it as ##d\textbf S=(dr e_r,rd\theta e_\theta,r\sin\theta d\phi e_\phi)##, or some equivalent form (I know that is not how you interpret it as it is not a Cartesian vector), so that I can evaluate ##(x,y,z)\cdot d\textbf{S} ##
 
Zack K said:
I should have clarified. I know ##dS= r^2sin\theta d\theta d\phi##. I want to be able to "interpret" it as ##d\textbf S=(dr e_r,rd\theta e_\theta,r\sin\theta d\phi e_\phi)##, or some equivalent form (I know that is not how you interpret it as it is not a Cartesian vector), so that I can evaluate ##(x,y,z)\cdot d\textbf{S} ##
If you find a way to parametrize your surface with ##\vec r(u,\,v)##, then you'll have:
$$d\vec S=\left(\frac{\partial\vec r}{\partial u}\times\frac{\partial\vec r}{\partial v}\right)du\,dv$$
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surface_integral#Surface_integrals_of_vector_fields
 
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