Vibration Massless spring static equilibrium

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the behavior of a massless spring at static equilibrium when an external force is removed. Participants explore the implications of the spring's masslessness on its vibrational characteristics, questioning the physicality of the scenario.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes that upon removing the force F, the spring would return to its original length L and stop moving, or alternatively, vibrate between L-d and L+d.
  • Another participant argues that the question is nonsensical because a massless spring does not exist, suggesting that the inquiry is fundamentally flawed.
  • Some participants suggest that if the spring were to vibrate, it would do so around the equilibrium point L, provided there are no dissipative forces acting on it.
  • One participant emphasizes that applying a non-zero force to a zero mass is unphysical, reinforcing the idea that the scenario lacks a realistic basis.
  • Another participant speculates that the original poster might be considering an infinitesimal mass rather than a truly massless spring, indicating a need for clarification on the assumptions involved.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally disagree on the physical validity of the scenario involving a massless spring. While some explore the implications of the spring's behavior, others assert that the premise itself is unphysical.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights limitations in the assumptions made about mass and physicality, with participants noting the implications of a massless spring in classical physics.

Gunmo
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Let us imagine that there is a Massless spring with fixed at one end.

Unloaded length = L

Spring constant: = k

Mass = 0The spring is at static Equilibrium

Force: F

Displacement: d

F = k d,
elongated length: L+d


If I remove F, what will happen ?

1. Spring return to the original length: L and Stop moving

2. Spring length vibrate between "L - d" and "L+d"

Note: there is no mass, damping, friction.
 
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Its possible to think and give some answers but it seems to me that they will be non-sense. And because this question is actually useless and non-physical (there is no massless spring!), I think its better that you don't ask this question and don't face such non-sense answers because of nothing!
 
When you remove the force F it gets vibrating around the equilibrium point L and keeps so provided there is no dissipating forces like the air resistance to deplete the vibrational energy of the spring.
 
PaulDirac said:
When you remove the force F it gets vibrating around the equilibrium point L and keeps so provided there is no dissipating forces like the air resistance to deplete the vibrational energy of the spring.
That's what any real spring would do, but OP has carefully specified a massless spring. As Shyan says, there is no solution in that case - we're applying a non-zero force to a zero mass and that situation is unphysical.
 
I understand. I was assuming that there is still a little mass in order to involve it in the vibration. Otherwise, it is nonsense to think of vibrating a massless spring. But I don't think that is what he means, i.e. we don't have any physical spring to be totally massless. By M = 0 I think he means an infinitesimal mass, say of order epsilon, though. He should specify..
 
Nugatory said:
we're applying a non-zero force to a zero mass and that situation is unphysical

I was thinking about another possibility, but as we are in classical physics you are right.
 

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