News What are the Key Factors for Victory in the 2008 Presidential Election?

[LowlyPion]

I'll bet a week from now, we'll see a "McCain Wins Election" ad.

Save it. Could be a collector's item like the "Dewey Beats Truman" headlines in the papers in 1948.

 

[Astronuc]

Ruben Navarrette - Commentary: McCain has his priorities straight
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/09/26/navarrette.obama.mccain/index.html

Earlier this week, McCain abruptly suspended his campaign and requested that the debate be postponed until Congress finishes the heavy lifting of approving a bailout. That put Obama and McCain in a classic Mexican standoff with each trying to look presidential, while attempting to map out a course that would benefit him politically.
. . .
After all the doom and gloom, pundits were then somehow surprised when McCain decided to temporarily suspend his presidential campaign and return to his day job in Congress, where he tried to work out a bailout deal with his colleagues. Well at least most of his colleagues.

Despite having decried the economic crisis in near-apocalyptic terms in an attempt to lay blame on President Bush and, by association, McCain, the junior senator from Illinois didn't feel the urgency to show up for work and try to do what he could to address it. Obama certainly has standing and more than his share of influence. This is, after all, the de-facto leader of the Democratic Party.
. . . .

OK - that's one version of what happened. But, . . .

http://www.cnn.com/2008/SHOWBIZ/TV/09/26/letterman.mccain.rant.ap/index.html

The late-night CBS comedian was upset Wednesday when McCain canceled an appearance to deal with the economic crisis.

After backing out of the Letterman show, McCain sat for an interview with Katie Couric, then didn't leave New York until Thursday, further angering Letterman.

So, apparently what did happen is that McCain delayed his return to Washington (so he didn't rush back), and when he got there, he disrupted the discussion (he huddled with GOP House members), and apparently did not try to work out anything with most of his colleagues, unless colleagues refers only to GOP members who oppose the bailout.

Meanwhile Obama reamins in touch with Congressional leaders.

Assuming an agreement was reached, then McCain and Obama can return Saturday to Washington. No need to pretend on McCain's part.

 

[Evo]

Here's Letterman's reaction, hillarious.

But it was prelude to the wrath of Letterman after McCain canceled an appearance on his show -- especially when Letterman found out that McCain was still doing an interview with Couric at CBS News.

“I’m more than a little disappointed by his behavior,” Letterman said of McCain's decision to cancel his appearance on the show and suspend his campaign until Congress passes a bailout plan.

“We’re suspending the campaign -- suspending it because there’s an economic crisis, or because the poll numbers are sliding?”

“You don’t suspend your campaign -- something about this stinks,” Letterman continued, using a phrase he would repeat over and over throughout the show. “Do you suspend your campaign? No, because that makes me think maybe there will be other things down the road, like if he’s in the White House, he might just suspend being president. I mean, we've got a guy like that now!”

Adding insult to injury, Letterman brought on MSNBC host and left-wing attack dog Keith Olbermann as the substitute guest for McCain.

During his chat with Olbermann, Letterman used the in-house CBS cameras and monitors to show McCain being readied for his interview with Couric on the set of the CBS Evening News.

“He doesn’t seem to be racing to the airport, does he?” Letterman said referring to McCain's call earlier in the day when he told Letterman he was canceling because "the economy is cratering" and he has to rush back to Washington to work on a Wall Street bailout plan.

“Hey John, I got a question! You need a ride to the airport?” Letterman yelled at the TV monitor as the in-house camera showed McCain talking to Couric.

The audience howled in delight at the merciless edge of Letterman's anti-McCain barbs. The comedian also repeatedly asked why McCain didn't send Palin in his place -- suggesting the GOP handlers were afraid that she couldn't handle it.

http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/entertainment/zontv/2008/09/couric_letterman_too_much_for.html

 

[LowlyPion]

...where he tried to work out a bailout deal with his colleagues.

I just don't see where that has happened at all. He's not been a part of any of the negotiations. He didn't even speak out in the meeting with the President by taking any position at all, even though he clearly knew his buddy Boehner was going to pee on the parade. I don't think he has yet to articulate a position other than what Obama has crafted.

And why did he know? Because he had apparently argued at the Republican Caucus that he needed a crisis if his candidacy was going to be successful and if they didn't want to have to be a smaller minority in the Congress they had to monkey wrench it.

Whatever happened it was so guileless that no one outside of Fox News has been fooled as to who had forced the disruption, and that rather than mediating, McCain's role has been that of petulant agitator desperate to save a sagging campaign.

 

[LowlyPion]

Here's Letterman's reaction, hillarious.

Getting the Late Night audiences against you is a swift current to swim against. That's middle America independents.

 

[turbo]

McCain's got another audience against him from the get-go.

One side effect of McCain's debate gambit is, I'm told, that everyone at Ole Miss now hates him. It will make for a very hostile audience tonight among those students and faculty attending. He might have to apologize for creating the uncertainty or make some explanation up front, which is never ideal.

http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=ZGMyMzdkMDk3NzNmM2EzMmRmNDAzYTZhMjlhM2Y4MzI=

Not an ideal situation for McCain, who will need some positive audience reaction for his spinners to use to proclaim his stunning victory in the debate.

 

[Astronuc]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080926/ap_on_el_pr/candidates_debate

McCain had also said he would suspend all campaign activities, but in reality the campaign just shifted to Washington while the work of trying to win the election went on.

McCain had taken a gamble with the move, trying to appear above politics and as a leader on an issue that had overshadowed the presidential campaign and given him trouble. But Democratic rival Barack Obama had not bowed to McCain's challenge, and instead questioned why the Republican nominee couldn't handle two things at once — the debate and involvement in the bailout negotiations.

An Associated Press-Knowledge Networks poll out Friday just before McCain's announcement showed the public overwhelmingly wanted the candidates to debate, 60 percent to 22 percent, with the rest undecided.

By Friday morning, it appeared McCain was looking for a face-saving way to get to the debate even though a deal had not been reached. He met with Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, R-Ky., and House Minority Leader John Boehner, R-Ohio, before heading to his campaign headquarters and issuing a statement that blamed others in Washington for the failure to reach an agreement.

It seemed they had an agreement until McCain showed up. Is this an example of McCain snatching defeat from the jaws of victory?

A president has to be able to handle two or more things at once. Apparently, McCain can't handle that. Will McCain call time outs during his presidency if he is elected?

 

[Astronuc]

Who's to Blame for the Bailout Deal's Stumble?
http://news.yahoo.com/s/time/whostoblameforthebailoutdealsstumble

John McCain arrived on Capitol Hill early Thursday afternoon just as a bipartisan group of senators and representatives were announcing they had reached an agreement on the broad outlines of a bill to bail out Wall Street. For a moment, as the press conference broke up, members of the media traveling with McCain mingled with reporters covering the Hill. "Wait, there's a deal?" one surprised McCain reporter asked his congressional colleague.

That one question summed up the confused state of a high-stakes day in the nation's capital that only got more confusing as the hours passed. For a few hours, it looked as if McCain, who came to Washington with the stated goal of helping to hammer out a final deal, had shown up just minutes too late to speed along the once-stalled negotiations. Then McCain, his Democratic rival Barack Obama and congressional leaders from both parties went to the White House for what some billed as a photo-op, a public showing of bipartisan support for a piece of legislation that Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke, Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson and the President himself have called absolutely vital to preventing economic collapse. Reporters waited and waited on the rainy White House driveway expecting to hear from the two candidates, only to be informed by Senator Richard Shelby, the top Republican on the Senate Banking Committee, that there was no deal.

With the fate of the bailout bill in peril, it's not clear whether the presence of the presidential candidates is doing more damage than good. Members of both parties emerged from that meeting accusing each other of playing politics with the crucial legislation. Both sides to some degree are right. Less than 40 days from the presidential election, this crisis has been anything but the shining moment where candidates transcend politics and come together for the good of the country - as McCain suggested it should be when he suspended his campaign and asked to postpone Friday's debate until a deal could be worked out.
. . . .
So what caused the breakdown of a $700 billion rescue package that at one point seemed to have been amended to everyone's liking - with limits on executive compensation, more protections for taxpayers and homeowners, and additional oversight of the buying and selling of Wall Street's toxic mortgage-backed securities? . . . .

Deal or No Deal?

 

[Evo]

I guess it will be me, the cat, and dog watching the debate tonight. They never seem to offer much in the way of opinions, unfortunately.

 

[LowlyPion]

I wouldn't mind at all if Obama called McCain reckless in his efforts to lift his sagging campaign. While I'm sure McCain will retreat at warp speed to saying that his action was solely motivated by his love for his country, this has been such a totally self serving political move as to be pretty obvious to anyone not watching Fox News. There they apparently think even his b.o. is perfume.

 

[turbo]

I guess it will be me, the cat, and dog watching the debate tonight. They never seem to offer much in the way of opinions, unfortunately.

They'll probably give you opinions as valuable as all the talking heads who will be falling over themselves to spin the debate for their candidate.

 

[NateTG]

"It seemed they had an agreement until McCain showed up. Is this an example of McCain snatching defeat from the jaws of victory?"

Honestly, McCain's campaign is looking pretty desperate. As such, a gambit like this isn't really that inappropriate. I think this will be remembered as the week that he lost the election though.

 

[Art]

What time is the debate on at? And what stations are showing it?

 

[LowlyPion]

What time is the debate on at? And what stations are showing it?

9:00 PM EST and more stations than you can shake a stick at.

 

[Art]

9:00 PM EST and more stations than you can shake a stick at.

Thanks LowlyPion. I'm in Ireland so I only get a few US stations such as Fox and CNN but if it's on several no doubt one of them will have it if I'm still awake at 2 a.m. that is.

 

[Astronuc]

Thanks LowlyPion. I'm in Ireland so I only get a few US stations such as Fox and CNN but if it's on several no doubt one of them will have it if I'm still awake at 2 a.m. that is.

I'm sure CNN will carry it. It will probably be on the internet by the morning.

 

[LowlyPion]

Thanks LowlyPion. I'm in Ireland so I only get a few US stations such as Fox and CNN but if it's on several no doubt one of them will have it if I'm still awake at 2 a.m. that is.

Yes, it is on CNN and Fox News and Fox and MSNBC and ABC, NBC, CBS, CSPAN, BBC America, PBS, and in Spanish on Telefutura and in French TV5Monde.

 

[Evo]

Yes, it is on CNN and Fox News and Fox and MSNBC and ABC, NBC, CBS, BBC America

You forgot C-SPAN and PBS stations, those are the English speaking channels covering it.

 

[LowlyPion]

You forgot C-SPAN and PBS stations, those are the English speaking channels covering it.

Yeah. I have those too now.

I note that TV Kuwait is not carrying it though.

 

[Evo]

I note that TV Kuwait is not carrying it though.

You apparently have more channels than I do.

 

[LowlyPion]

You apparently have more channels than I do.

1951

But a number are radio. And I didn't mention the radio stations that are carrying it. There is an Asian and Indian station that I didn't find, but seeing as how its for Ireland and all ...

 

[Andre]

I guess it will be me, the cat, and dog watching the debate tonight. They never seem to offer much in the way of opinions, unfortunately.

Sure, they do. Their opinion is probably that a little petting is much more important than two guys yelling to each other Ask them.

 

[Astronuc]

The McCain-Obama debate -

Ouch! That hurt my ears.

Obama was not as smooth as I expected, and didn't sound like a great orator. McCain was smoother, but offered the same old tired rhetoric.

I turned it off when McCain mentioned that we have to drill off-shore.

Frankly, I could have done a better job addressing federal spending, taxes, the bailout, energy, healthcare, eductaion, national security, . . . .

I going to read a book.

 

[Pyrrhus]

The McCain-Obama debate -

Ouch! That hurt my ears.

Obama was not as smooth as I expected, and didn't sound like a great orator. McCain was smoother, but offered the same old tired rhetoric.

I turned it off when McCain mentioned that we have to drill off-shore.

Frankly, I could have done a better job addressing federal spending, taxes, the bailout, energy, healthcare, eductaion, national security, . . . .

I going to read a book.

I agree, I wonder if Biden would do a better job against Palin in the VP Debate.

 

[Evo]

Both came off very well, but I've got to say that Obama completely changed my impression of him tonight. I never cared for Obama, never thought he was that great at speaking, but tonight, he was awesome. He was to the point and had great, focused statements.

So, I take back any reservations on Obama that I had, tonight won me over. He is the only choice.

Just on health care alone, Obama is the only choice. McCain's tax credit for Americans to "shop around" is insane. Obviously he has no idea what getting health insurance is like. He is apparently oblivious to the fact that if you have a pre-existing condition, you will be virtually unable to get health insurance to cover it at any cost. McCain is clueless on health insurance. And he wants to tax my health insurance?

 

[Art]

SkyNews here, an affiliate of Fox News, gave it hands down to Obama. Although they thought both of their spiels were the standard stock fare delivered a hundred times before they thought Obama's presentation style was vastly superior to McCain's and they thought that McCain badly underperformed on what was supposed to be his strong suit.

Personally I thought Obama looked a hell of a lot more comfortable than when he debated with Clinton and looked by far the more presidential of the two candidates.

So far McCain has always far outperformed Obama in polls on the issue of foreign policy, it will be interesting to see if this debate changes the numbers.

 

[Defennder]

I count myself as an Obama supporter, and while I believe he didn't make any gaffes, tonight he failed to score a knockout against McCain. That doesn't mean he didn't "win", or whatever you guys mean when you say "win".

Anyway, while I think he did better against McCain than against Hillary in the primaries, he just wasn't as Astronuc put it, "smooth" enough.

 

[Evo]

BUWAHAHAHAHA.

On CNN, they just had a great interview with Biden, impressive. Wolf said he would have hoped that Palin would also have been willing to talk and the host says "Don't hold your breath on that one".

 

[TheStatutoryApe]

I was disappointed in the way Obama spoke about Iraq and Afghanistan. McCain made the proper point that regardless of whether Iraq was a good idea in the first place or not the next president will have to deal with the fallout. Obama simply continued to criticize the original decision. I'm bothered that he doesn't seem to want to discuss in a clear fashion what he thinks ought to be done. What bothers me more is that he kept talking about Afghanistan and sending more troops there. He seemed to be invoking the desire for vengence and probably for little other reason than to show he is not 'soft' and will support military actions. "...and kill Osama bin Laden" was probably the worst part of what he said.

 

[LowlyPion]

After carefully listening to the debate, and of course totally discounting and laying aside any mild bias that I may possibly have harbored prior to the debate, I thought that Obama did the far better job.

McCain was petulant, disdainful, not always answering the question directly and tended to ramble. What a sour loser.

If Obama was to be faulted it was perhaps for being a little too gracious and diplomatic and maybe even could have been more provocative in needling McCain. But his account of things seemed the more reasoned.