What can you expect in the Food Thread on PF?

[Evo]

This is where I must ask: what is "real traditional pizza dough"?

If you wanted to get very specific, that would be where it originated with the original Margherita pizza.

 

[turbo]

Pizza is much older than that. Flat-breads topped with sauces, oils, vegetables, herbs, cheeses, etc have been around for as long as there have there been ovens and agrarian societies. Want to claim that only Napoletana pizza is "authentic" or only Sicilian pizza is "authentic", or only Tuscan pizza is "authentic"? Knock yourself out. It's a silly game with no winners. The truth is much more complex than commercial "reality".

 

[nismaratwork]

Hmmm... I guess at some point we need to identify the point where flat-bread doughs, or the Japanese version like Okonomiyaki?
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b8/Okonomiyaki_-_shrimp_and_cheese_okonomiyaki.jpg

When it comes to the pizza that we eat, I think the Margherita is a good start for what any of us would call "pizza". The thing is, that dough wasn't new, which goes back to Turbo's point... and of course that is just one style.

I liken this to donuts: probably raised came first, then cake... but aren't they still donuts? Were they donuts when the Dutch had no holes in them, but the essential recipe and cooking method was the same?

I think we can identify our modern pizza, but not the modern pizza DOUGH or technique, which is the real issue here. I can accept that we find progenitors in unrelated cultures, but then we can correctly say that our pizza and roman flat-breads evolved separately.

After all, put some cheese and sauce on Paratha, and it's still not pizza in my book. By the same token, give me a bagel and the same ingredients and I happily think, "Pizza bagel!" If we're really going to dig this one out, I think we need to accept that while we might all agree on something... it still won't be definitive.

Still... pizza and flat-breads... when the two don't cross in culinary history, we should follow the "pizza" link, if only because that was the actual evolutionary path.

 

[Evo]

Homemade jalapeno cornbread.

 

[ziesha]

i m a big foodie

 

[nismaratwork]

Homemade jalapeno cornbread.

Take me! *faints*

 

[Evo]

Okay, I miss watching tv shows with other PF members. Christina, where are you?

Who would like to watch an episode of the Original Iron Chef Japanese with me? I was thinking Battle Octopus to start with. It's in five 10 minute segments on youtube. If anyone is interested in watching it with me and exchanging fun comments here, let me know. Turbo, have you ever watched the original Japanese version? I think turbo and nismar would be fun to watch with. Got to have some real foodies involved, but even novices would enjoy the show.

 

[nismaratwork]

Octopus... segments...? On a side-note, I think I've seen every 'Tezushin!' out there. I um... had a brief period where I danced with the leafy green if you catch my drift, and I found that show UTTERLY engrossing.

...
...
...

To be fair, I found a lot of things engrossing, but I STILL enjoy the show. As a longtime fan of Japanese animation (NOT the porn aka Hentai) it was pure entertainment. Anytime Evo... anytime.

edit: Over a decade later I still can crack up one friend with a muttered, "Watakushi no kioku ga tashika naraba..."

edit 2: Oh yes, and that same friend actually made the famous "blue crab brains dressing"... it wasn't half bad...
Also, if any of you have been to Nobu, I want details... I mean pornographic details of the entire experience.

 

[Evo]

Octopus... segments...? On a side-note, I think I've seen every 'Tezushin!' out there. I um... had a brief period where I danced with the leafy green if you catch my drift, and I found that show UTTERLY engrossing.

...
...
...

To be fair, I found a lot of things engrossing, but I STILL enjoy the show. As a longtime fan of Japanese animation (NOT the porn aka Hentai) it was pure entertainment. Anytime Evo... anytime.

edit: Over a decade later I still can crack up one friend with a muttered, "Watakushi no kioku ga tashika naraba..."

edit 2: Oh yes, and that same friend actually made the famous "blue crab brains dressing"... it wasn't half bad...
Also, if any of you have been to Nobu, I want details... I mean pornographic details of the entire experience.

YAY! if turbo doesn't join, we can watch together. Who knew crab brains were blue?

 

[nismaratwork]

YAY! if turbo doesn't join, we can watch together. Who knew crab brains were blue?

No no... blue-crab's brains! I think they were kind of... pale... orange. Let's put it this way, it helped that I had the dressing before I was aware of its contents.

Now we have to rope in turbo... maybe Rhody? "Come on you dogs, do you want to live forever?!"

 

[turbo]

No no... blue-crab's brains! I think they were kind of... pale... orange. Let's put it this way, it helped that I had the dressing before I was aware of its contents.

Now we have to rope in turbo... maybe Rhody? "Come on you dogs, do you want to live forever?!"

I''m in for a lot of seafood and variations. Unlike some, I've grown up with a lot of financial restrictions and seasonal excesses in that department. Seafood prices were a lot more flexible before flash freezing, fast shipping, etc made it possible to double, triple, etc the dock prices that the fishermen were paid.

You should know that lobster and crab prices, and shrimp and scallop prices used to hit seasonal lows in cold weather so that normal people could actually afford to treat their families from time to time.

 

[Evo]

So it looks like nismar and I will watch Battle Octopus.

nismar, here is part 1, you'll see the other parts.

 

[nismaratwork]

So it looks like nismar and I will watch Battle Octopus.

nismar, here is part 1, you'll see the other parts.

Thanks for the link! Now... let's see if this is one I've viewed before...

 

[nismaratwork]

AHHH! Otoh! Oh man, the "Otoh Faction"... heh... I loved that one. Next to the Congar Eel they had to nail to the board, this is arguably one of the more impressive shows. Sakai is by far my favorite... humble, but with truly god-like culinary skills. How he makes those sauces in that time is beyond me... Are you listening Bobby Flay?!

 

[Evo]

Have you seen this one? There are so many great shows. Did you see when Ohta shaved his head and threw down a challenge?

Sakai is a genius.

 

[Evo]

Oh, I forgot to post this link, this is the technique on video for stretching the pizza dough in the traditional manner that was mentioned in my previous links. This is for thin crust, if you like it a bit thicker, there are instructions for a stretched and patted dough below, but no video.

http://how-to-stretch-pizza-dough.blogspot.com/

Nismar, this sounds like the method that you also mention using?

Have you watched part 2 of Octopus Battle yet?

 

[nismaratwork]

Oh, I forgot to post this link, this is the technique on video for stretching the pizza dough in the traditional manner that was mentioned in my previous links. This is for thin crust, if you like it a bit thicker, there are instructions for a stretched and patted dough below, but no video.

http://how-to-stretch-pizza-dough.blogspot.com/

Nismar, this sounds like the method that you also mention using?

Have you watched part 2 of Octopus Battle yet?

Yes, and Yes! I love to stretch dough on a board, especially when I grill pizza; you get a wonderful inconsistant gluten formation that makes the texture very interesting. I also just enjoy it, and it's quick and easy if you're using shaped and proofed dough.

I have to say, Sakai is a genius, but I'd forgotten Otoh with his knife skills. I know he won eventually, but I can't remember if this is the one!

 

[Evo]

You might have also seen this technique. The slapping method is the one I always saw being used in Sicily.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zanN1hfEZdw&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zanN1hfEZdw

This video is showing the legal Neapolitan Pizza. The EU has actually set the law that this is the only way a pizza can be legally called Napolitana.

http://www.newser.com/story/75825/neapolitan-pizza-wins-protected-status.html

Which leads to a very funny story. At one restaurant I went to with my Sicilian fiance, they obviously noticed that I was American. His pizza was perfect, but after a couple of minutes of me trying to cut into my pizza with no success, I had to ask him to try. After a couple of minutes he just banged the knife into the pizza with all of his strength and the pizza fractured and shards went flying across the room. We think they might have actually put instant cement in the dough as a joke. It wasn't edible.

 

[Kevin_Axion]

You might have also seen this technique. The slapping method is the one I always saw being used in Sicily.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zanN1hfEZdw&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zanN1hfEZdw

This video is showing the legal Neapolitan Pizza. The EU has actually set the law that this is the only way a pizza can be legally called Napolitana.

http://www.newser.com/story/75825/neapolitan-pizza-wins-protected-status.html

Which leads to a very funny story. At one restaurant I went to with my Sicilian fiance, they obviously noticed that I was American. His pizza was perfect, but after a couple of minutes of me trying to cut into my pizza with no success, I had to ask him to try. After a couple of minutes he just banged the knife into the pizza with all of his strength and the pizza fractured and shards went flying across the room. We think they might have actually put instant cement in the dough as a joke. It wasn't edible.

I WANT PIZZA !

I'm going to Spain and Portugal in 3 weeks and I'll post pictures of what I eat for each meal.

 

[nismaratwork]

I just can't help but think some olive oil on that crust would be a help. Still... very impressive pie, and I LOVE the oven.


Oh... and do be careful that nobody is killed with pizza-shrapnel.

Heh... so much for just spilling water huh?

@Kevin: Pictures! YES!

 

[Evo]

I WANT PIZZA !

I'm going to Spain and Portugal in 3 weeks and I'll post pictures of what I eat for each meal.

Kevin, you lucky devil! I want pictures of everything!

 

[Kevin_Axion]

Kevin, you lucky devil! I want pictures of everything!

Everything! Especially Gaudi's work :D.

 

[Astronuc]

Does anyone remember Bennetts Chili or Cocktail Sauces?

http://foodlion.elsstore.com/brandstores/46-bay-valley/categories/275-bennett

We can't find it locally anymore, but apparently it can be ordered.

Amazon has a bottle for $27.70.

It's really good over sausages and potatoes.

 

[turbo]

Does anyone remember Bennetts Chili or Cocktail Sauces?

http://foodlion.elsstore.com/brandstores/46-bay-valley/categories/275-bennett

We can't find it locally anymore, but apparently it can be ordered.

Amazon has a bottle for $27.70.

It's really good over sausages and potatoes.

Years back, some friends moved to the west coast and discovered an awful truth. Cain's mayonnaise, tartar sauce, sandwich spread, and other products that they liked aren't sold out there. Friends and family were pressed into service periodically to send "care packages" of regional favorites that they missed.

 

[nismaratwork]

Does anyone remember Bennetts Chili or Cocktail Sauces?

http://foodlion.elsstore.com/brandstores/46-bay-valley/categories/275-bennett

We can't find it locally anymore, but apparently it can be ordered.

Amazon has a bottle for $27.70.

It's really good over sausages and potatoes.

I've always used Heinz Chili sauce, but I LOVED Bennet's Horseradish Cocktail sauce! My grandparents introduced me to it, and being the freakishly odd fellow I was, I LOVED the horseradish and tamarind flavor (that "tangy" element beyond vinegar).

Oh, and don't despair Atronuc!... "Item Weight: 15.6 pounds"... I believe that is a CASE of the sauce!

 

[Evo]

Oh, and don't despair Atronuc!... "Item Weight: 15.6 pounds"... I believe that is a CASE of the sauce!

Or one REALLY BIG bottle!

 

[nismaratwork]

Or one REALLY BIG bottle!

Yes, just what we all want in life, a Magnum of Cocktail sauce!


Wait.. that actually sounds pretty good.

 

[Astronuc]

I cooked a variation of a Shepherd's stew or potatoe hash this evening.

I browned 4 sausages (2 spicy Italian and 2 sweet Italian), and added mixed sweet peppers (eq. of 1 large bell pepper) and sliced onion (1 onion). To this I added 3 turnips and 2 potatoes - all washed, peeled and diced. On the side I cooked some kale, and only added melted butter over it. It served 4. If one is cooking for one or two, one freeze the extra for later in the week.

For the sausage, I would recommend one 6 or 8-inch (15 - 20 cm) link per person. I'd recommend 1 turnip and 1 potato per person. I only had 3 turnips, and I could have added two more potatoes, or one per person. Raw turnip tastes a bit like horseradish (both are from the Brassicaceae family), but when cooked they get sweeter. It was really good and the kale complemented it well. I could have added chicken broth for flavor.

We often do sausage and potatoes like this. One can add rutabaga or turnip, or chopped parsnip and carrot, which I also like. The spicy and sweet sausages give a nice flavor.

Bennetts chili sauce goes well with sausage and potatoes.


One can also make a kale and potato soup with sausage.


Here is another recipe my wife recommends:

Shepherd's Stew

1 lb sweet or hot Italian sausage, sliced (medallions)
1 large onion
6 potatoes, peeled (or washed) and diced
1 cup sliced celery, including leaves
2 cans (16 oz) whole tomatoes (or stewed)
1/4 cup chopped fresh parsley
1-1/2 cups of beef broth or stock (or 2 beef bouillon cubes in 4/3 cups of water)
1 bay leaf
1/2 tsp dried thyme
1/4 teaspoon pepper
juice of 1/2 lemon (optional)


Brown sausage on medium heat. Add onion and saute until transparent (~5 min). Add remaining ingredients and bring to boil. Reduce heat and simmer, uncovered, for 45 to 60 min, or until potatoes are tender.

 

[nismaratwork]

I cooked a variation of a Shepherd's stew or potatoe hash this evening.

I browned 4 sausages (2 spicy Italian and 2 sweet Italian), and added mixed sweet peppers (eq. of 1 large bell pepper) and sliced onion (1 onion). To this I added 3 turnips and 2 potatoes - all washed, peeled and diced. On the side I cooked some kale, and only added melted butter over it. It served 4. If one is cooking for one or two, one freeze the extra for later in the week.

For the sausage, I would recommend one 6 or 8-inch (15 - 20 cm) link per person. I'd recommend 1 turnip and 1 potato per person. I only had 3 turnips, and I could have added two more potatoes, or one per person. Raw turnip tastes a bit like horseradish (both are from the Brassicaceae family), but when cooked they get sweeter. It was really good and the kale complemented it well. I could have added chicken broth for flavor.

We often do sausage and potatoes like this. One can add rutabaga or turnip, or chopped parsnip and carrot, which I also like. The spicy and sweet sausages give a nice flavor.

Bennetts chili sauce goes well with sausage and potatoes.


One can also make a kale and potato soup with sausage.


Here is another recipe my wife recommends:

Shepherd's Stew

1 lb sweet or hot Italian sausage, sliced (medallions)
1 large onion
6 potatoes, peeled (or washed) and diced
1 cup sliced celery, including leaves
2 cans (16 oz) whole tomatoes (or stewed)
1/4 cup chopped fresh parsley
1-1/2 cups of beef broth or stock (or 2 beef bouillon cubes in 4/3 cups of water)
1 bay leaf
1/2 tsp dried thyme
1/4 teaspoon pepper
juice of 1/2 lemon (optional)


Brown sausage on medium heat. Add onion and saute until transparent (~5 min). Add remaining ingredients and bring to boil. Reduce heat and simmer, uncovered, for 45 to 60 min, or until potatoes are tender.

Damn... I'm going to pick up some stock and Kale at and make that with my leftover Pork and Chciken Kabanosy! I'll have to add spice another way, but it should work. Thanks for the recipe... and buttered kale... yum.

Have you ever had properly made Bubble & Squeak?... you might enjoy it, especially with some good corned beef.

 

[Astronuc]

Italian Turnip and Rice Soup with Parmesan Cheese
This elegant soup has a flavour that sharpens the appetite in unexpected ways; serve hot to 6 people as a first course, most especially before pork.

http://www.mrneep.co.uk/italiansoup.htm