What caused galaxies to start spinning?

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    Galaxies Spinning
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the question of what causes galaxies to start spinning, exploring the mechanisms behind angular momentum in the formation of galaxies. It includes theoretical considerations about gas clouds, angular momentum conservation, and the conditions necessary for galaxy formation.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that a uniform blob of gas cannot start spinning by itself due to the conservation of angular momentum, suggesting the need for an external force to impart angular momentum.
  • Others argue that a quasi-uniform gas cloud can form spinning galaxies while preserving zero total angular momentum, with galaxies potentially spinning around different axes.
  • One viewpoint emphasizes that the gas forming a galaxy likely already possesses non-zero total angular momentum, which increases as the gas contracts.
  • Another participant notes that in reality, a perfectly uniform blob of gas with zero angular momentum is statistically unlikely, and if such a blob existed, it would not form a galaxy but rather collapse into a black hole.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that a uniform blob of gas is unlikely to have zero angular momentum, but there is disagreement regarding the mechanisms that lead to the spinning of galaxies, with multiple competing views presented.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights limitations in the assumptions about gas uniformity and angular momentum, as well as the dependency on definitions of angular momentum in different contexts.

fbs7
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If I take a big, uniform blob of gas that is not spinning, and mark its limit as the limit of a system, then even if that big blob of gas coalesces to make a galaxy, it will not start spinning by itself: its own gravity is an internal force, and conservation of angular momentum says I need an external force to add angular momentum to the system.

As galaxies spin, either:
(a) my big blob of gas was already spinning before it started to become a galaxy, or
(b) there was some external torque applied to my system

So, what's the best explanation as to why galaxies spin?
 
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fbs7 said:
If I take a big, uniform blob of gas that is not spinning, and mark its limit as the limit of a system, then even if that big blob of gas coalesces to make a galaxy, it will not start spinning by itself: its own gravity is an internal force, and conservation of angular momentum says I need an external force to add angular momentum to the system.
A quasi uniform gas cloud with zero total angular momentum, can form many spinning galaxies while preserving zero total angular momentum. They spin around different axes in different directions.
fbs7 said:
As galaxies spin, either:
(a) my big blob of gas was already spinning before it started to become a galaxy, or
(b) there was some external torque applied to my system
It's (a). The gas that later forms a single galaxy already has non zero total angular momentum. The closer it gets together, the higher the angular velocity becomes.
 
A.T. said:
It's (a). The gas that later forms a single galaxy already has non zero total angular momentum. The closer it gets together, the higher the angular velocity becomes.
Ah, I see. So there's no such thing in reality as a uniform blob of gas with perfectly zero angular momentum relative to its center of mass. It will have some variations in velocity, and these variations create a non-zero angular momentum. The bigger the blob, the bigger the angular momentum generated by these irregularities.

Now that you explained, it seems obvious to me - the smallest disturbance will get the thing to spin as it contracts.

Thanks for the explanation! :smile:
 
fbs7 said:
Ah, I see. So there's no such thing in reality as a uniform blob of gas with perfectly zero angular momentum relative to its center of mass.
It is statistically unlikely. And, event there was one, then it would not form a Galaxy, just collapse radially into a BH. So you never see those non-rotating Galaxies.
 

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