What Do Quotes Reveal About Our Understanding of Love and Pride?

[Zeteg]

I've been thinking about the following few quotes, and each time, it reminds me of how many different ways one's thoughts can be processed. I'll give my thoughts... what do you guys think about them?

"Sometimes I wonder, what's the reason why... we long for someone to embrace and say hello to say goodbye" - Forever (Edguy)
When I read this (heard this, actually), I thought it as quite a negative comment. However, when I think about it more and more, it makes more and more sense. Why do us--humans, wish love so much, when each and every one of us realizes we'll lose it one day? Yet, even with such perceptions, nothing changes. Does this mean that we're not as logical as we once thought, and that, love is merely a hinderence?

"And I've got that experience nobody can steal away. A moment of your life is mine, I'll remember day by day" - Scarlet Rose (Edguy)
This one really touched me. It seems to express the views of a man so deprived of anything, that he's satisfied in his own memories. I seem to think about this one as, "No matter what we lose, or what we don't have, there's always that something". It's a bit trite, and most of us can't induldge ourselves in it, but isn't it true? Though we know it's the logical thing to do, why is that we can't bring ourselves to see the light in situations?

"You need to show them you're superior, you lead the field. No one opposes you and all men must yield"
"You need to show your old man, that you're in control, to be successful, you'd sell your own soul"
"You have no time for commitments, they just get in the way. Get down to business, there's no time to play"
- Pride (Ayreon)

This to me, perfectly describes pride, and arrogance. I believe that... well, this is essentially the "perfect" way of life. If everyone had that attitude, then everyone would strive. However, why is it that we precieve these with thoughts of "arrogance", which carries negative connotations? Do we strive, not to be "perfect"?

 

[tribdog]

I think you are flawed in your way of defining perfection. If everyone had that attitude nothing would get done, "too many cooks..."

Here's my favorite quote on the subject of perfection.
Little Jimmy was in First Grade. One day after school he walked into his bathroom and accidently saw his father urinating. "What's that?" Jimmy said pointing.
"That," said Jimmy's dad, "That is a penis, a perfect penis."
The next day at school Jimmy stood in the front of the class for show and tell. He pulled down his pants and said, "this is a penis, if it was just a couple inches shorter it would be perfect."

 

[JasonRox]

I think you are flawed in your way of defining perfection. If everyone had that attitude nothing would get done, "too many cooks..."

Here's my favorite quote on the subject of perfection.
Little Jimmy was in First Grade. One day after school he walked into his bathroom and accidently saw his father urinating. "What's that?" Jimmy said pointing.
"That," said Jimmy's dad, "That is a penis, a perfect penis."
The next day at school Jimmy stood in the front of the class for show and tell. He pulled down his pants and said, "this is a penis, if it was just a couple inches shorter it would be perfect."

I was hoping for a mature post, but I guess not.

Maybe the first quote has a connection with the second quote. The one you long for now becomes memory that you soon enjoy. You enjoy life regardless of what moment it is. Think about it. If you are the person, you have a great time and embrace every moment together. If you are not with the person, you love the memories that you will always have of each other.

Considering it's from the same person, it could be possible.

I know he's mentionned a lot, but here is some of Einstein's.

"A hundred times every day I remind myself that my inner and outer life are based on the labors of others."

- I think about this kind of stuff all the time. Sometimes I'll be on the computer or learning something new in class, and then I'll just stop. I just sit there and think about the people who put me here today. I admire them.

I also think of other things too.

For example, how we complain on how we are starving when we haven't ate in 3-5 hours. I think of those in Third World Countries.

 

[Entropy]

Quote:
Originally Posted by tribdog
I think you are flawed in your way of defining perfection. If everyone had that attitude nothing would get done, "too many cooks..."

Here's my favorite quote on the subject of perfection.
Little Jimmy was in First Grade. One day after school he walked into his bathroom and accidently saw his father urinating. "What's that?" Jimmy said pointing.
"That," said Jimmy's dad, "That is a penis, a perfect penis."
The next day at school Jimmy stood in the front of the class for show and tell. He pulled down his pants and said, "this is a penis, if it was just a couple inches shorter it would be perfect."


I was hoping for a mature post, but I guess not.

Ha! I'm not mature I guess.

 

[JasonRox]

Ha! I'm not mature I guess.

Most people say being curious is good.

I'm curious to know whether or not tribdog is funny in person.

Note: I'm talking about a closed-google conversation.

 

[tribdog]

nope I'm not funny at all.
What's a closed google conversation?
and I thought I was making a good point about the third quote and Zeteg's comments about it. I don't think it is the "perfect" way to be ie superior, controling and with no time for play. My joke was simply a way of pointing out that different people have different ideas about what perfect is, and tomorrow someone will remember reading this thread and what do you think they will remember? Zeteg's quote or my joke? Just because something is funny doesn't mean it should be dismissed.

 

[JasonRox]

nope I'm not funny at all.
What's a closed google conversation?
and I thought I was making a good point about the third quote and Zeteg's comments about it. I don't think it is the "perfect" way to be ie superior, controling and with no time for play. My joke was simply a way of pointing out that different people have different ideas about what perfect is, and tomorrow someone will remember reading this thread and what do you think they will remember? Zeteg's quote or my joke? Just because something is funny doesn't mean it should be dismissed.

I never said it was funny.

I can't answer the "closed Google question" because that would be rude. All I can say is, think about it.

 

[tribdog]

I never said it was funny.

I can't answer the "closed Google question" because that would be rude. All I can say is, think about it.

oh, and we wouldn't want you to appear rude now would we?

 

[JasonRox]

oh, and we wouldn't want you to appear rude now would we?

You appear funny and I appear rude, what's wrong with that?

Note: I'm not posting here anymore unless the thread gets back on track. Let's not hijack a potentially good thread topic.

 

[tribdog]

You appear funny and I appear rude, what's wrong with that?

Note: I'm not posting here anymore unless the thread gets back on track. Let's not hijack a potentially good thread topic.

Is that supposed to be a threat? If you didn't post anywhere anymore I'd be hard pressed to find a downside.

 

[Andy]

"**** Happens" Me-2005

I prefer funny to rude, being rude doesn't make any friends and you will get very lonely.

 

[franznietzsche]

I think you are flawed in your way of defining perfection. If everyone had that attitude nothing would get done, "too many cooks..."

Here's my favorite quote on the subject of perfection.
Little Jimmy was in First Grade. One day after school he walked into his bathroom and accidently saw his father urinating. "What's that?" Jimmy said pointing.
"That," said Jimmy's dad, "That is a penis, a perfect penis."
The next day at school Jimmy stood in the front of the class for show and tell. He pulled down his pants and said, "this is a penis, if it was just a couple inches shorter it would be perfect."

Just beautiful trib. Hilarious.

 

[Zeteg]

I think you are flawed in your way of defining perfection. If everyone had that attitude nothing would get done, "too many cooks..."

Here's my favorite quote on the subject of perfection.
Little Jimmy was in First Grade. One day after school he walked into his bathroom and accidently saw his father urinating. "What's that?" Jimmy said pointing.
"That," said Jimmy's dad, "That is a penis, a perfect penis."
The next day at school Jimmy stood in the front of the class for show and tell. He pulled down his pants and said, "this is a penis, if it was just a couple inches shorter it would be perfect."

I beg to differ. If everyone strived to be at the top, then things would get done. You say that somebody needs to cook my food? Yes, well, those are the people that strive, but can't reach. In reality, no matter how hard some people strive, they just won't ever come to anything good. While, others, may not strive at all, and still be near the top.

I don't really see how your quote has any relevence to 'perfection'. :O

 

[tribdog]

I beg to differ. If everyone strived to be at the top, then things would get done. You say that somebody needs to cook my food? Yes, well, those are the people that strive, but can't reach. In reality, no matter how hard some people strive, they just won't ever come to anything good. While, others, may not strive at all, and still be near the top.

I don't really see how your quote has any relevence to 'perfection'. :O

I wasn't saying someone needs to cook your food, I was making reference to an old saying: "too many cooks spoil the broth"
If everyone wants to be boss nothing gets done.
My quote was simply a way to point out that perfection can mean different things to different people. Your definition, of doing whatever it takes to reach the top is different from mine. I think it is more important to lift everyone around you to a higher level even if it keeps you from making it to the top.

 

[JasonRox]

I think it is more important to lift everyone around you to a higher level even if it keeps you from making it to the top.

I have to agree with you here.

 

[Zeteg]

I think it is more important to lift everyone around you to a higher level even if it keeps you from making it to the top.

Well, you've made your point, certainly. We definitely do have different ways of thinking. I couldn't continue life, with that attitude.

However, with your analogy, "Too many cooks spoil the broth", I do have a rebuttle. Your analogy is flawed. See, there's only a certain amount of 'positions' for cooks. Obviously, they'll go to the best cooks. The best cook, will in turn, be the head cook. Thus, even though everyone wants to be at the top, only one person will. However, everyone will thus be trying their absolute hardest, and I don't see what harm can come from that... do you?

 

[tribdog]

Well, you've made your point, certainly. We definitely do have different ways of thinking. I couldn't continue life, with that attitude.

However, with your analogy, "Too many cooks spoil the broth", I do have a rebuttle. Your analogy is flawed. See, there's only a certain amount of 'positions' for cooks. Obviously, they'll go to the best cooks. The best cook, will in turn, be the head cook. Thus, even though everyone wants to be at the top, only one person will. However, everyone will thus be trying their absolute hardest, and I don't see what harm can come from that... do you?

yes I do, what does a person willing to sell his soul to make it do, if there isn't enough room at the top? He makes a position available by removing someone else.

 

[Zeteg]

Yes, but the "removing" wouldn't be done illegally, now would it?

Just look at the "what if" everyone was like that. Everyone would realize everyone is striving. Obviously, the legal system is going to be a lot tougher, and the police will be a lot more efficient in finding criminals. If they're striving, they wouldn't risk that.

 

[tribdog]

Yes, but the "removing" wouldn't be done illegally, now would it?

Just look at the "what if" everyone was like that. Everyone would realize everyone is striving. Obviously, the legal system is going to be a lot tougher, and the police will be a lot more efficient in finding criminals. If they're striving, they wouldn't risk that.

doesn't have to be illegally, how about immorally. Spreading rumors, office intrigue etc.
What about the guy with a family barely making ends meet who's been with a company for years. Along comes some single guy barely out of school, who is marginally better at the job. You would have him take the first guy's job. I don't agree with that.

 

[Zeteg]

doesn't have to be illegally, how about immorally. Spreading rumors, office intrigue etc.
What about the guy with a family barely making ends meet who's been with a company for years. Along comes some single guy barely out of school, who is marginally better at the job. You would have him take the first guy's job. I don't agree with that.

Err... If he can't do the job as well as someone that just came out of school, then he should not be there. ... ... ... Sorry, but I fail to see your argument.

Why should we let sympathy stand in the way of success? If someone doesn't bear ability, they should go, "extinct", correct? That is the way of nature, anyhow. Why shield them from the 'winds that sweep the earth'?

 

[tribdog]

Err... If he can't do the job as well as someone that just came out of school, then he should not be there. ... ... ... Sorry, but I fail to see your argument.

Why should we let sympathy stand in the way of success? If someone doesn't bear ability, they should go, "extinct", correct? That is the way of nature, anyhow. Why shield them from the 'winds that sweep the earth'?

you just better hope that someone who thinks like you do doesn't come along to your job.
Take it a step further. A lot of kids just became orphans because of the tsunami. there is no benefit to someone who donates aid. So according to you I should keep my money and let the kids die.
Sympathy, compassion and good will are not negative traits. You just go ahead and build up that bank account, I'd rather help a homeless guy get something to eat.

 

[Zeteg]

you just better hope that someone who thinks like you do doesn't come along to your job.
Take it a step further. A lot of kids just became orphans because of the tsunami. there is no benefit to someone who donates aid. So according to you I should keep my money and let the kids die.
Sympathy, compassion and good will are not negative traits. You just go ahead and build up that bank account, I'd rather help a homeless guy get something to eat.

Excuse me. I did not say I was heartless.

First of all, I don't really have a 'real' job, 'cause I just turned 16 some time ago and am still in school. I life guard once a week, for several reasons, which gives me a bit of pay. Certainly enough for my age. I also work with a quantum mechanics professor at a local university.

Certainly, if I had a job, and someone more qualified was to come along, and I conceded to the fact, he/she was more qualified, I would wonder why I lost my job, nor would I be angry.

As for homeless people, I refrain from giving them money because for the most part, they don't spend it on food. When they ask me for food (when I'm eating a pizza and walking for example), I usually pass them a piece, or give them what's left. I'll give them spare change, if they amuse me... For example, one homeless man had a sign saying, "Need money for booze, alergic to water".

Anyway, many people feel 'warmth' for donating. It makes them feel better about themselves, and essentially, that's why they do it. If they didn't, they'd feel guilty. Others do it for publicity, and some I guess, are truly loving. I don't have anything against giving Tsunami victims aid, for they did not bring it upon themselves.

I think you should understand that.

 

[tribdog]

Excuse me. I did not say I was heartless.

First of all, I don't really have a 'real' job, 'cause I just turned 16 some time ago and am still in school. I life guard once a week, for several reasons, which gives me a bit of pay. Certainly enough for my age. I also work with a quantum mechanics professor at a local university.

Certainly, if I had a job, and someone more qualified was to come along, and I conceded to the fact, he/she was more qualified, I would wonder why I lost my job, nor would I be angry.

As for homeless people, I refrain from giving them money because for the most part, they don't spend it on food. When they ask me for food (when I'm eating a pizza and walking for example), I usually pass them a piece, or give them what's left. I'll give them spare change, if they amuse me... For example, one homeless man had a sign saying, "Need money for booze, alergic to water".

Anyway, many people feel 'warmth' for donating. It makes them feel better about themselves, and essentially, that's why they do it. If they didn't, they'd feel guilty. Others do it for publicity, and some I guess, are truly loving. I don't have anything against giving Tsunami victims aid, for they did not bring it upon themselves.

I think you should understand that.

in your prior post you said someone who doesn't bear ability should go extinct.and that we shouldn't let sympathy stand in the way of our success. I was simply taking it a step further to include people who don't have the ability to survive without help.
I'm sure right now you are the smartest kid in your school. I was to at your age and I probably felt the same as you do. It's great to always let ability decide the pecking order when you are the best. I don't think that way anymore I think it is, and should be, more complicated than that, and sympathy, empathy and rumpathy should all play a part .

 

[Astronuc]

See, there's only a certain amount of 'positions' for cooks. Obviously, they'll go to the best cooks. The best cook, will in turn, be the head cook. Thus, even though everyone wants to be at the top, only one person will. However, everyone will thus be trying their absolute hardest, and I don't see what harm can come from that...

The real world does not work that way. From personal experience with many companies, including some of the top companies in US, the best do not always get picked for the lead jobs. Management is sometimes (and maybe too often) fickle. I have seen the best passed over, and the long term result is declining performance in the company. Then look at all the massive failures recently.

In terms of the ideal, I call upon the analogy of mountain climbing. One reaches the pinnacle, spends some time there, and then descends to find another mountain to climb. The ascent if often a shared or team experience.

I stongly advocate mentoring by those who have been successful, and I would hope that one's successors provide mentoring to their successors, and so on.

 

[Zeteg]

in your prior post you said someone who doesn't bear ability should go extinct.and that we shouldn't let sympathy stand in the way of our success. I was simply taking it a step further to include people who don't have the ability to survive without help.
I'm sure right now you are the smartest kid in your school. I was to at your age and I probably felt the same as you do. It's great to always let ability decide the pecking order when you are the best. I don't think that way anymore I think it is, and should be, more complicated than that, and sympathy, empathy and rumpathy should all play a part .

Well, I'll give my brain another five years to develop fully. Then I'll continue this argument, since I guess, it is senseless to do so now. Let's wait =)