What is the Bell-like Inequality in Classical Physics?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the Bell-like inequality in classical physics, particularly in the context of the GHZ (Greenberger-Horne-Zeilinger) experiment. Participants explore the implications of this inequality, its violation, and the characteristics of GHZ states in relation to measurements of polarization.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants inquire about the existence of specific directions where the Bell-like inequality is maximally violated.
  • One participant notes that the GHZ experiment is characterized as an "all or nothing" test, suggesting that a single experimental run can invalidate local realism.
  • There is a question regarding whether GHZ states always yield the same outputs when measuring the same property of the particles, specifically in terms of polarization.
  • Another participant asserts that GHZ states are only HHH + VVV along a given direction and provides a transformation example to illustrate this point.
  • A participant references a Nature article that explains how the GHZ experiment disproves local realism by demonstrating observable outcomes that contradict local hidden variable predictions.
  • Some participants express interest in obtaining the formulas from the referenced article, citing the cost as a barrier to access.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the outputs of GHZ states and the implications of the Bell-like inequality. There is no consensus on the specifics of the inequality's violation or the characteristics of GHZ states.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the dependence on definitions of polarization and the specific conditions under which the GHZ states are measured. The discussion does not resolve the mathematical details or assumptions involved in the claims made.

Heidi
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Hi Pfs
I read in the GHZ experiment article
that classical physics give an inéquality (a Bell like inequality)
Is there also sets of directions where this inequality is maximally violated ?
thanks
 
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Heidi said:
Hi Pfs
I read in the GHZ experiment article
that classical physics give an inéquality (a Bell like inequality)
Is there also sets of directions where this inequality is maximally violated ?
thanks

GHZ is often characterized as an "all or nothing" test. In principle, a single experimental run (of 3 total GHZ entangled photons) is enough to invalidate local realism.

It's a bit difficult to get that from the Wiki article, but here is the related quote they provide:

"For instance, if the polarization of two of the photons are measured and determined to be rotated +45° from horizontal, then local hidden variable theory predicts that the polarization of the third photon will also be +45° from horizontal. However, quantum mechanical theory predicts that it will be −45° from the same axis."
 
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Have we always 3 same outputs ,with a GHZ state, when we measure the same thing on the particles? linear polarization along a same direction, or same circular polarization?
or is GHZ HHH + VVV state on a given direction?
 
Heidi said:
Have we always 3 same outputs ,with a GHZ state, when we measure the same thing on the particles? linear polarization along a same direction, or same circular polarization?
or is GHZ HHH + VVV state on a given direction?
No, we don't always have 3 same outputs with a GHZ state. GHZ state is only HHH + VVV on a given direction. You can just try out a simple transformation to a specific other direction (like L/R instead of H/V) to see this:
(L+R)(L+R)(L+R) + (L-R)(L-R)(L-R) = 2LLL + 2LRR + 2RLR + 2RRL
 
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Have a look at this Nature article. There it's explained in a very understandable way. The nice feature of the GHZ experiment is that it disproves the "local realism" a la EPR not with the violation of Bell inequality but disproving it by demonstrating that a certain observable takes the opposite value of what local realism predicts, of course in accordance with the prediction of QT:

https://www.nature.com/articles/35000514
 
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could you write the formulas of this article (with some comments)
the price of the article is too expensive (32 dollars)
 
Heidi said:
could you write the formulas of this article (with some comments)
the price of the article is too expensive (32 dollars)
Here is the free version:

https://arxiv.org/abs/quant-ph/9810035
 
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