Which Canadian university should I go to for physics undergrad?

[blueballoon]

I'm a grade 11 student in Canada. I love physics and want to work as a researcher someday. I'll be applying to universities in a couple of months. I'm trying to decide which I want to go to because I like having a clear plan ahead of me.

UofT is a great option for me (close to home), but I've heard that they keep student GPAs really low. This may be a problem for me because I want to go to grad school afterwards. Will UofT really kill my GPA and ruin chances at getting in, even if I focus all my efforts on doing my academic best? Maybe UofT is a school I should consider for my graduate studies, not undergrad?

Is UWaterloo a better option? Any great programs at other schools I should consider? I've done a bit of searching myself, but I haven't fully considered everything because I'm not yet sure if I'll be able to move away from home. Either way, I'd love some advice on which Canadian programs/schools are best, regardless of location. I want to get a great education, but I also want to be able to continue that education and therefore need to keep GPA in mind. Thank you!

 

[Vanadium 50]

Will UofT really kill my GPA

"It is difficult to predict, especially the future: - N, Bohr

 

[jack action]

McGill has a physics program. This is one of the most reputable universities in Canada.

 

[Choppy]

I've heard that they keep student GPAs really low

It's best not to make life decisions on hearsay evidence.

Unless you have actual data to support this, it's much more likely that it's an excuse propagated by students who aren't performing as well in the program as they would like.

In my experience the quality of physics education across Canadian universities is generally quite high, regardless of where you attend. And the difference between students competing to get into graduate school is much more heavily weighted by the quality of the student than the program they've come through.

What you do have to consider with "big name" schools is that their programs are bigger. Advantages that come with them include more optional classes, more opportunities to explore specific sub-fields, and more research opportunities. On the flip side, the class sizes tend to be larger, which can make it more challenging to get to know your professors and you more easily default to being "just a number."

The smaller schools tend to be more specialized... so less opportunities to explore the full breadth of physics, but your professors are more likely to know who you are.

My advice is to explore as much as you can. Go and visit the campuses you're interested in. Most schools will have tours and even days that allow potential students and come and see what they have to offer. When making your decision try to factor in where you are most likely to perform to your full potential.

 

[Vanadium 50]

McGill

And UBC, UVic, Alberta (if you can stand the cold), Regina ("the city that rhymes with fun"), Simon Fraser (the world's ugliest campus)...

 

[Office_Shredder]

Toronto is like, a big school. The idea that graduate programs haven't figured out how to compare the GPA from Toronto to other schools seems silly to me.

 

[CrysPhys]

UofT is a great option for me (close to home), but I've heard that they keep student GPAs really low. This may be a problem for me because I want to go to grad school afterwards. Will UofT really kill my GPA and ruin chances at getting in, even if I focus all my efforts on doing my academic best? Maybe UofT is a school I should consider for my graduate studies, not undergrad?

I don't know anything about the University of Toronto and its grading system (you should confirm). But if what you think is true, and if you have enough self-confidence, then if you do get a high GPA there, it will give you a great plus going forward.

I once served as an industry mentor to a student who had completed her undergrad in China and came to the US for her PhD (engineering, not physics). As she was finishing her PhD, I helped her with her job search. I later had the occasion to meet the manager who hired the PhD. Turns out the manager had also completed her undergrad at the same university in China as the PhD had. The manager told me it was one of the toughest universities in China. She (the manager) told me that when she read the PhD's resume and saw that the PhD had an equivalent undergrad GPA of 4.0/4.0, she was totally floored: it was extremely rare. The manager told me that indicated that the PhD was both really smart and worked really hard: qualities she valued in an employee.

 

[Vanadium 50]

I don't know anything about the University of Toronto

Big school, nice neighborhood, ugly library.

I agree with @Office_Shredder - people know how to calibrate. And it cuts both ways - there are schools known for horrific grade inflation, and there if you get under a 3.pickyourfavoritenumber doors start closing.

Toronto suffers from the same rep as many highly selecting schools. Students who were able to coast through high school discover that this is no longer good enough. Clearly the school's fault.

 

[gwnorth]

UofT is a great option for me (close to home), but I've heard that they keep student GPAs really low.

This is mostly an urban legend perpetuated by high school students. The reality is that the educational quality across the majority of universities in Canada is pretty uniform and Physics in particular will have a pretty standardized core curriculum. The first year program at UofT does offer the ability to take more challenging introductory sequences for math though and some of the core courses may be taught at a slightly higher level (or at least so I have been told based on the textbooks used).

Having said that what does vary across universities is the quality of your peers (though less of an issue for Physics since academic low performers don't tend to choose Physics as a major anyway) and the number of offerings for non-core courses and the ability to get involved in research. UofT being a very large school offers a far larger choice of elective courses than many other programs and has greater opportunities for undergrad research. On the other hand their undergraduate program is also larger (I've been told that each year's cohort at the St George campus is about 50 or so students. In comparison McMaster's is about half that) so you will be competing with more students for opportunities and to be at the top of the class. So the question is can you be a big fish in a big pond? Would attending a very large university be a good fit for you personally so that you can excel? If so UofT would probably be an excellent choice. Waterloo's program is also highly regarded and probably on par. On the other hand if you don't think a large school would suit you and you don't think you would excel in that environment, I would think twice about attending. To be a top contender you will need to very proactive and take the initiative to seek out opportunities. They will not be handed to you on a plate and you will be competing with many highly ambitious peers for those opportunities. If you are not the type to be aggressive in networking and searching out opportunities it may not be a good fit for you and you may perform better at a smaller school. This is the trade off you need to decide for yourself (and an interesting example of a very small program that appears to have an outsized success in placing their students in graduate programs relative to their size is Mount Allison).

As a side note, presupposing that grad school is in your future, the most recent publishing of the entering cohort for Physics master's at UofT shows they admitted 12 students from their own undergraduate program (from all3 campuses combined), far more than from any other. Waterloo and McGill were tied for 2nd place with about 5 a piece. It's hard to say whether that means the admissions committee favours those schools and attending those programs gives you a boost in competitiveness, or whether their higher admission rate is a function of program size and the number of applicants. Presumably other top students from UofT were also admitted to and chose to attend other top ranked masters or direct-entry PhD programs, but I don't have that data. It certainly it appears that graduates of the program have excellent options for post-graduate study.

https://www.physics.utoronto.ca/graduate/welcome/are-you-thinking-about-coming-toronto/