Why flow has high velocity when partially closed?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the phenomenon of increased fluid velocity when a hose is partially closed, specifically in the context of water flow from a tank through a garden hose. Participants explore the implications of Bernoulli's equation and the relationship between pressure, flow rate, and velocity in fluid dynamics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions why the velocity of water increases when the hose is partially closed, referencing Bernoulli's equation which suggests velocity should remain constant.
  • Another participant proposes that the increase in velocity is due to the need for the same volume of water to exit the hose per second, leading to a higher exit velocity when the cross-sectional area is reduced.
  • A participant discusses the ideal scenario where pressure losses are negligible, suggesting that in such cases, the velocity would remain constant regardless of the hose closure.
  • Some participants argue that real-life factors such as pressure losses from the tap and hose affect the actual velocity, and that these losses become less significant when the flow rate is decreased by partially closing the hose.
  • There is contention regarding the significance of pressure losses, with some asserting they are minimal while others claim they can exceed 90% in an open hose scenario.
  • One participant references a previous discussion that includes mathematical analysis of flow rates and pressure losses in hoses, emphasizing the relationship between mass flow rate and velocity when the outlet is restricted.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the role of pressure losses and whether the flow rate in the pipe remains constant. There is no consensus on the significance of these factors, and the discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that assumptions regarding ideal conditions may not hold in practical scenarios, and the discussion includes varying interpretations of how flow rate and velocity interact under different conditions.

nirmaljoshi
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I want to ask why flow has high velocity when partially closed. Eg. when we partially close garden's hose pipe, the flow goes much more farther than when fully open.

Supposing water is flowing through a pipe from a constant level water tank. Why flow has high velocity when partially closed? According to Bernoulli's equation, velocity is given by v^2/2g=h. Thus, velocity should be constant. Isn't it?
 
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I believe it's because the same amount of water has to come out of the hose end per second as goes into the end. Since the gap for it to do so becomes smaller, it is forced to come out at a faster rate (amount of water going through = rate * cross-sectional area). It is the same as if you blow out (through the mouth) when whistling as opposed to when your mouth is fully open.

Please correct me if I got something wrong.
 
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If the pressure supplied at the tap were ideal and if the hose itself did not impose any losses then it would not matter how tightly you squeezed your thumb across the end of the hose. The water would squirt at the same speed. That speed could be calculated by equating the pressure energy ##pV## of the water entering the hose to the kinetic energy ##\frac{1}{2}mv^2## of the water squirting out.

In real life, the tap imposes some pressure loss, the hose induces some pressure loss and the plumbing in the house may induce some as well. The pressure at the end of the hose is less than the pressure the water company supplies to your house and the speed of the squirting water is reduced accordingly. But if you press your thumb tightly over the end of the hose, you decrease the flow rate (volume per unit time) going through the hose. This means that those losses become less important. The water under your thumb can reach the full water company pressure and the squirting water can reach full speed as calculated by the equation above.
 
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jbriggs444 said:
If the pressure supplied at the tap were ideal and if the hose itself did not impose any losses then it would not matter how tightly you squeezed your thumb across the end of the hose. The water would squirt at the same speed. That speed could be calculated by equating the pressure energy ##pV## of the water entering the hose to the kinetic energy ##\frac{1}{2}mv^2## of the water squirting out.

In real life, the tap imposes some pressure loss, the hose induces some pressure loss and the plumbing in the house may induce some as well. The pressure at the end of the hose is less than the pressure the water company supplies to your house and the speed of the squirting water is reduced accordingly. But if you press your thumb tightly over the end of the hose, you decrease the flow rate (volume per unit time) going through the hose. This means that those losses become less important. The water under your thumb can reach the full water company pressure and the squirting water can reach full speed as calculated by the equation above.

The loss in hose pipe should insignificant (less than 1%) and it depends on velocity of flow in pipe. Therefore, it is not the loss that should be main variable.

Again if we think flow rate in pipe should be constant as Misha Kuznetsov thinks. Is there any equation to support his idea?
 
nirmaljoshi said:
The loss in hose pipe should insignificant (less than 1%) and it depends on velocity of flow in pipe. Therefore, it is not the loss that should be main variable.
There is no reason to think that the flow rate in the pipe will be constant!
 
nirmaljoshi said:
The loss in hose pipe should insignificant (less than 1%)...
For an open hose, that's nowhere close to correct. The loss is in excess of 90%.
...and it depends on velocity of flow in pipe.
Yes: so when you restrict the outlet and reduce the flow rate, the velocity through the rest of the pipe except the outlet itself goes down.
Again if we think flow rate in pipe should be constant...
The flow rate is most certainly not constant. What do you think valves are for?
 
For a pretty extensive discussion on this topic, see this thread: https://www.physicsforums.com/threa...d-same-pressure-as-slower-wider-fluid.816605/

At one point in there I actually go through the whole bit of math and show the flow rate through and pressure losses in a garden hose as a function of how much of it you cover with your hand.

In essence, the water speeds up because you have some roughly constant mass flow rate and when you cover the end partially, the same mass has to pass through a smaller area in the same amount of time, thus a higher velocity. As it also turns out, the pressure losses are quite small until you have a fairly large portion of the end covered. Take a look to see the whole discussion. The part where I work out the whole problem is near the end.
 

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