X-ray structure analysis question

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the challenges of detecting light elements, specifically hydrogen, in X-ray structure analysis (XRD) of crystalline compounds. Participants explore the limitations of XRD in accurately determining the presence of hydrogen in compounds like CaClH, which was misidentified as CaCl due to these limitations.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that XRD is routinely used to solve structures of crystalline compounds containing hydrogen, suggesting that detecting hydrogen is not inherently difficult.
  • Another participant proposes that the low electron density of hydrogen makes it less detectable in XRD due to reduced interaction with X-ray photons.
  • A further contribution emphasizes that XRD measures electronic density, and hydrogen's single electron makes it less visible, especially when adjacent to more electronegative atoms like chlorine.
  • Concerns are raised about the resolution required to distinguish hydrogen in the presence of chlorine, with a suggestion that older experiments may have had lower resolution capabilities.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the detectability of hydrogen in XRD, with some asserting it is possible while others highlight significant challenges. The discussion does not reach a consensus on the effectiveness of XRD for detecting hydrogen.

Contextual Notes

Participants mention the dependence on experimental factors such as crystal purity and resolution, which may affect the ability to detect light elements like hydrogen in XRD analyses.

Trave11er
Messages
71
Reaction score
0
Hello everyone!

I have met such a curious thing: When chemists tried to synthesize CaCl by reducing CaCl2 with H2 they got CaClH instead, but the structure of a compound was determined using X-ray structure analysis which is not suitable for determining the position of light elemnts like hydrogen, thus the presence of hydrogen was missed and CaClH was thought to be a CaCl for a long time. Can anybody explain, why this X-ray technique cannot be applied to light atoms? Thank you.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
These days XRD is routinely used by chemists for solving the structure of crystalline compounds and these compounds contains H atoms. So i think it is not difficult to detect H atoms in XRD. But one reason coming to my mind is...H has low electron density around nucleus so less interection of X-ray photons with electrons..so may be difficult to detect.
 
Well, remember what you're measuring with XRD - electronic density.
Hydrogen atoms only have a single electron, (okay, two here) so they're small and not very visible using XRD. It depends on what kind of resolution you have (which in turn is dependent on experimental factors, such as the purity of your crystal)

Now in this specific case, you've got a chlorine atom (very electronegative, lots of electronic density) with a tiny hydrogen next to it, so you're basically just looking for a slight 'bump' on the chlorine density rather than a well-defined sphere, so you'd need pretty good resolution to see it.

Although for an inorganic substance (nice crystals) I'd think the resolution today would usually be good enough. Was this an old experiment? (60s-70s?) I do know that for protein structures (where resolution is much lower) that they often can't really distinguish between OH and Cl, for instance.
 
Thank you for such comprhensive explanation - I really appreciate it and learned much new from it. The experiment was carried even earlier - 1953 ^).
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
13K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
Replies
5
Views
507
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
1K
Replies
8
Views
5K
  • · Replies 34 ·
2
Replies
34
Views
11K