What is spin? (advanced question)

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter pellman
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Spin
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of spin in quantum mechanics, particularly in the context of the Dirac field operator and its transformation properties. Participants explore the definition and characteristics of spin operators, the role of the Pauli-Lubanski pseudovector, and the implications of commutation relations with the Dirac Hamiltonian.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that the operator S, defined through transformation properties under rotation, should represent the z-component of the spin operator.
  • Another participant questions the significance of an operator not commuting with \(\gamma^{\mu}\partial_{\mu}\) and its necessity for being a good spin operator, proposing a connection to the Hamiltonian's role in time evolution.
  • A different viewpoint states that spin need not be conserved, particularly in the context of the Dirac Hamiltonian, emphasizing that total angular momentum is the conserved quantity.
  • One participant expresses confusion regarding the treatment of the Pauli-Lubanski pseudovector in Ryder's book, noting that while it relates to the non-relativistic spin operator in the rest frame, its role as a generalized relativistic spin operator is not adequately explained.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the definition and properties of spin operators, particularly regarding the Pauli-Lubanski pseudovector and its relationship to the Dirac Hamiltonian. The discussion remains unresolved with multiple competing perspectives on the nature of spin and its operators.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the discussion regarding the assumptions made about the definitions of spin and the implications of commutation relations, which are not fully explored or resolved.

pellman
Messages
683
Reaction score
6
I had thought that if under an infinitesimal rotation by \theta around the z-axis a quantity transforms according to

\psi\rightarrow\left(1+i\left[S+\left(\frac{1}{i}x\frac{\partial}{\partial y}-\frac{1}{i}y\frac{\partial}{\partial x}\right)\right]\theta\right)\psi

then the operator S is by definition the z-component of the spin operator for that quantity.

However, the Dirac field operator transforms (in the appropriate representation) according to

\psi\rightarrow\left(1+i\left[\frac{1}{2}\left(\begin{array}{cc}\sigma_{z}&0\\ 0&\sigma_{z}\end{array}\right)+\left(\frac{1}{i}x\frac{\partial}{\partial y}-\frac{1}{i}y\frac{\partial}{\partial x}\right)\right)\theta\right]\right)\psi

yet https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0521478146/?tag=pfamazon01-20 states that \tau_{z}=\frac{1}{2}\left(\begin{array}{cc}\sigma_{z}&0\\0&\sigma_{z}\end{array}\right) cannot be the spin operator because it does not commute with \gamma^{\mu}\partial_{\mu} The correct spin operator is--or has something to do with--the Pauli-Lubanski pseudovector.

My question is, first, what's wrong with not commuting with \gamma^{\mu}\partial_{\mu}? Why is that necessary for the a good spin operator?

And secondly, if \tau_{z} is not a good spin operator, what about the fact that it generates the non-scalar part of a rotation? Is that not the definition of spin?
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Physics news on Phys.org
pellman said:
My question is, first, what's wrong with not commuting with \gamma^{\mu}\partial_{\mu}? Why is that necessary for the a good spin operator?

I don't know a definitive answer. However, isn't a part of \gamma^{\mu}\partial_{\mu} the Hamiltonian? And (of course) if we want the eigenvalues of some operator to be constant in time, we require the operator to commute with the Hamiltonian.
 
The spin needn't be conserved. Actually for the Dirac Hamiltonian it isn't. It's only the total angular momentum that is conserved for a Hamiltonian generated time-evolution.

Actually, besides the total momentum and angular momentum, the Pauli-Lyubanski pseudovector also commutes with the Hamiltonian and therefore is conserved for all projective unitary irreds of the restricted Poincare' group.

Daniel.
 
I have also problems to understand that section of Ryder's book. In the part where Wigner's little group is discussed it is shown in detail that the non-relativistic spin operator is the correct spin operator in the rest frame of a particle. Moreover, it is shown how the Pauli-Lubanski pseudovector reduces basically to the non-relativistic spin operator in the rest frame. But it seams to me that he does not spend a word to explain why the Pauli-Lubanski pseudovector should actually provide a generalized relativistic spin operator.
 
Last edited:

Similar threads

  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 56 ·
2
Replies
56
Views
5K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
1K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K