15.2.87 Write the following integrals as a single iterated integral.

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around rewriting two given double integrals as a single iterated integral. Participants explore the regions of integration and the appropriate limits for the iterated integral, focusing on the mathematical reasoning involved in changing the order of integration.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses uncertainty about how to approach the problem, indicating they have not done this type of integration before.
  • Another participant describes the regions of integration for the first integral, noting the limits for \(x\) and \(y\) based on the provided integral.
  • There is a discussion about the vertical strips needed to rewrite the integrals, with one participant suggesting the limits for \(y\) should be \(-1 \le y \le 1\).
  • Another participant challenges this by stating that the length of the vertical strip will vary depending on its position, implying that the limits need to be reconsidered.
  • Further clarification is provided regarding the need to express the \(y\)-coordinates of the vertical strips in terms of \(x\), leading to a discussion about the equations \(x = e^{-y}\) and \(x = e^y\).
  • Participants derive the expressions for \(y\) in terms of \(x\), arriving at \(y = -\ln{x}\) for the lower limit and \(y = \ln{x}\) for the upper limit.
  • There is a consensus on the outer integral limits being \(1 \le x \le e\), but the final formulation of the single iterated integral remains unresolved.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the final form of the single iterated integral, as the discussion is still ongoing and various aspects of the integration limits are being debated.

Contextual Notes

Participants are working through the implications of changing the order of integration, and there are unresolved questions about the correct limits for the iterated integral based on the regions described.

karush
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Draw the regions of integration and write the following integrals as a single iterated integral.
$$\displaystyle\int_{0}^{1} \int_{e^y}^{e} f(x,y)\,dx\,dy + \int_{-1}^{0} \int_{e^{-y}}^{e}f(x,y) \,dx\,dy$$
ok haven't done this before so kinda clueless
 
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Re: 15.2.87 write the following integrals as a single iterated integral.

karush said:
Draw the regions of integration and write the following integrals as a single iterated integral.
$$\displaystyle\int_{0}^{1} \int_{e^y}^{e} f(x,y)\,dx\,dy + \int_{-1}^{0} \int_{e^{-y}}^{e}f(x,y) \,dx\,dy$$
ok haven't done this before so kinda clueless

Let's begin with the first integral:

$$I_1=\int_{0}^{1} \int_{e^y}^{e} f(x,y)\,dx\,dy$$

We see that this region is:

$$e^y\le x\le e$$

$$0\le y\le1$$

We'll fill in that region with red. For the second integral, we have:

$$I_2=\int_{-1}^{0} \int_{e^{-y}}^{e}f(x,y) \,dx\,dy$$

We see that this region is:

$$e^{-y}\le x\le e$$

$$-1\le y\le0$$

We'll fill that region in with green...so we have:

View attachment 7255

In order to write this as a single integral, we'll need to reverse the order of integration, and use vertical strips. Can you state the lower and upper limits for these vertical strips in terms of $y$?
 

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Re: 15.2.87 write the following integrals as a single iterated integral.

the vertical strips in terms of y would be
$$-1\le y \le 1$$
 
Re: 15.2.87 write the following integrals as a single iterated integral.

karush said:
the vertical strips in terms of y would be
$$-1\le y \le 1$$

Not even close. Draw in a vertical strip ANYWHERE in the region. It should be obvious that depending on where you draw it, the strip will have VARIABLE length.
 
Re: 15.2.87 write the following integrals as a single iterated integral.

karush said:
the vertical strips in terms of y would be
$$-1\le y \le 1$$

I was kind of sloppy in my language before...you want the $y$-coordinates of the lower and upper ends of the strips (since the inner integral has the differential $dy$), but you want them in terms of $x$.

Does that make sense?
 
Re: 15.2.87 write the following integrals as a single iterated integral.

so you mean

$1 \le x \le e $
 
Re: 15.2.87 write the following integrals as a single iterated integral.

karush said:
so you mean

$1 \le x \le e $

No, the bottom of a vertical strip is on the curve:

$$x=e^{-y}$$

Now, we want to solve this for $y$...what do you get?
 
Re: 15.2.87 write the following integrals as a single iterated integral.

$\ln {x} = -y$
$-\ln{x} =y$
 
Re: 15.2.87 write the following integrals as a single iterated integral.

karush said:
$\ln {x} = -y$
$-\ln{x} =y$

Okay, good...how about the upper limit?
 
  • #10
Re: 15.2.87 write the following integrals as a single iterated integral.

MarkFL said:
Okay, good...how about the upper limit?

I would presume simply
$\ln{x}=y$
 
  • #11
Re: 15.2.87 write the following integrals as a single iterated integral.

karush said:
I would presume simply
$\ln{x}=y$

Yes, and for the outer integral, you've already correctly stated:

karush said:
so you mean

$1 \le x \le e $

Putting everything together, what is the single iterated integral?
 

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