2nd order differential - particular solution

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around solving a second-order differential equation of the form \(2\frac{{d^2 x}}{{dt^2 }} + 5\frac{{dx}}{{dt}} + 2x = 2t + 9\). Participants are tasked with finding both the general and particular solutions, with specific initial conditions provided for the latter. The context includes modeling the motion of a particle on the x-axis and determining the minimum distance from the origin.

Discussion Character

  • Mixed

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the general solution using characteristic equations and propose particular solutions based on given conditions. There are discussions about the correctness of derived expressions and the interpretation of derivatives. Some participants question the setup of the problem and the implications of negative distances in the context of the physical model.

Discussion Status

Several participants have provided insights and calculations related to the general and particular solutions. There is acknowledgment of correct approaches, but also confusion regarding the interpretation of results, particularly concerning the minimum distance. The conversation reflects a collaborative effort to clarify misunderstandings and validate findings.

Contextual Notes

Participants note potential confusion arising from the use of variable names, where \(x\) represents the function and \(t\) the independent variable. There is also mention of assumptions regarding the physical meaning of distances in the context of the problem.

W3bbo
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[SOLVED] 2nd order differential - particular solution

Homework Statement



a) Find the general solution of the differential equation:

\[2\frac{{d^2 x}}{{dt^2 }} + 5\frac{{dx}}{{dt}} + 2x = 2t + 9\]<br />

b) Find the particular solution of this differential equation for which:

\[x = 3{\rm{ and }}\frac{{dy}}{{dx}} = - 1{\rm{ when }}t = 0\]

c) The particular solution in part b) is used to model the motion of a particle P on the x-axis. At time t seconds (t>=0), P is x metres from the origin O. Show that the minimum distance between O and P is

\[{\textstyle{1 \over 2}}\left( {5 + {\mathop{\rm Ln}\nolimits} \left( 2 \right)} \right)\]

Homework Equations



N/A

The Attempt at a Solution



<br /> \[<br /> \begin{array}{c}<br /> 2\frac{{d^2 x}}{{dt^2 }} + 5\frac{{dx}}{{dt}} + 2x = 2t + 9 \\ <br /> \\ <br /> x = e^{mt} ;\frac{{dx}}{{dt}} = te^{mt} ;\frac{{d^2 x}}{{dt^2 }} = t^2 e^{mt} \\ <br /> \\ <br /> 2t^2 e^{mt} + 5te^{mt} + 2e^{mt} = 0 \\ <br /> e^{mt} \left( {2t^2 + 5t + 2} \right) = 0 \\ <br /> t_1 = - {\textstyle{1 \over 2}} \\ <br /> t_2 = - 2 \\ <br /> \end{array}<br /> \]

Complimentary:
Ae^{ - 2t} + Be^{ - {\textstyle{1 \over 2}}t}

Particular:
<br /> $\begin{gathered}<br /> x = at + b;\frac{{dx}}<br /> {{dt}} = a;\frac{{d^2 x}}<br /> {{dt^2 }} = 0 \\ <br /> \\ <br /> 2\left( 0 \right) + 5\left( a \right) + 2\left( {at + b} \right) = 2t + 9 \\ <br /> 5a + 2at + 2b = \\ <br /> 2b + a\left( {5 + 2t} \right) = \\ <br /> 2at = 2t \\ <br /> a = 1 \\ <br /> \\ <br /> 5a + 2b = 9 \\ <br /> b = 2 \\ <br /> \therefore \\ <br /> x = Ae^{ - 2t} + Be^{ - \tfrac{1}<br /> {2}t} + t + 2 \\ <br /> \end{gathered} $<br /> <br />


That's my solution to Part A, Mathematica agrees with me when I run:

Code:
In[1]:= DSolve[ 2y''[x] + 5y'[x] + 2y[x] == 2x+9, y[x], x  ]
Out[1]= y[x] -> 2 + x + e^(-x/2) * C[1] + e^(-2x) * C[2]

(Note y substituted for x, x substitued for t, C[1] for B, and C[2] for A.)

For part B, I got:

<br /> $\begin{gathered}<br /> x = Ae^{ - 2t} + Be^{ - \tfrac{1}<br /> {2}t} + t + 2 \\ <br /> 3 = Ae^{ - 2\left( 0 \right)} + Be^{ - \tfrac{1}<br /> {2}\left( 0 \right)} + 0 + 2 \\ <br /> 3 = A + B + 2 \\ <br /> 1 = A + B \\ <br /> \\ <br /> \frac{{dx}}<br /> {{dt}} = - 2Ae^{ - 2t} - \tfrac{1}<br /> {2}Be^{ - \tfrac{1}<br /> {2}t} + 1 \\ <br /> - 1 = - 2A - \tfrac{1}<br /> {2}B + 1 \\ <br /> \\ <br /> A = 1 - B \\ <br /> - 1 = - 2\left( {1 - B} \right) - \tfrac{1}<br /> {2}B + 1 \\ <br /> 0 = B \\ <br /> A = 1 \\ <br /> \\ <br /> \therefore \\ <br /> x = e^{ - 2t} + t + 2 \\ <br /> \end{gathered} $<br />

However this doesn't work with the last question (C), since the minimum of that function isn't located at ~2.84

Any ideas where I've gone wrong?

Thanks!
 
Last edited:
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Find dx/dt and equate to zero and find the value for t that makes x a minimum(I got\frac{1}{2}ln2).
sub that value into the Particular solution and it should work out.
 
Last edited:
W3bbo said:

Homework Statement



a) Find the general solution of the differential equation:

\[2\frac{{d^2 x}}{{dt^2 }} + 5\frac{{dx}}{{dt}} + 2x = 2t + 9\]<br />

b) Find the particular solution of this differential equation for which:

\[x = 3{\rm{ and }}\frac{{dy}}{{dx}} = - 1{\rm{ when }}t = 0\]
I assume you mean dx/dt, not dy/dx.

c) The particular solution in part b) is used to model the motion of a particle P on the x-axis. At time t seconds (t>=0), P is x metres from the origin O. Show that the minimum distance between O and P is

\[{\textstyle{1 \over 2}}\left( {5 + {\mathop{\rm Ln}\nolimits} \left( 2 \right)} \right)\]

Homework Equations



N/A

The Attempt at a Solution



<br /> \[<br /> \begin{array}{c}<br /> 2\frac{{d^2 x}}{{dt^2 }} + 5\frac{{dx}}{{dt}} + 2x = 2t + 9 \\ <br /> \\ <br /> x = e^{mt} ;\frac{{dx}}{{dt}} = te^{mt} ;\frac{{d^2 x}}{{dt^2 }} = t^2 e^{mt} \end{array}
No, dx/dt= m e^{mt} and d^2x/dt^2= m^2 e^{mt}<br /> [/quote]\begin{array} 2t^2 e^{mt} + 5te^{mt} + 2e^{mt} = 0 \\ &lt;br /&gt; e^{mt} \left( {2t^2 + 5t + 2} \right) = 0 \\ &lt;br /&gt; t_1 = - {\textstyle{1 \over 2}} \\ &lt;br /&gt; t_2 = - 2 \\ &lt;br /&gt; \end{array}&lt;br /&gt; \]<br /> t is your variable- you trying to find values for m, the coeficient in the exponent.<br /> <br /> <blockquote data-attributes="" data-quote="" data-source="" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-content"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandContent js-expandContent "> Complimentary:<br /> Ae^{ - 2t} + Be^{ - {\textstyle{1 \over 2}}t}<br /> <br /> Particular:<br /> &lt;br /&gt; $\begin{gathered}&lt;br /&gt; x = at + b;\frac{{dx}}&lt;br /&gt; {{dt}} = a;\frac{{d^2 x}}&lt;br /&gt; {{dt^2 }} = 0 \\ &lt;br /&gt; \\ &lt;br /&gt; 2\left( 0 \right) + 5\left( a \right) + 2\left( {at + b} \right) = 2t + 9 \\ &lt;br /&gt; 5a + 2at + 2b = \\ &lt;br /&gt; 2b + a\left( {5 + 2t} \right) = \\ &lt;br /&gt; 2at = 2t \\ \end{gathered} </div> </div> </blockquote>
<br /> I&#039;m not sure why you would write it like that. 2at+ (5a+ 2b)= 2t+ 9 is simpler.<br /> <br /> \begin{gathered} a = 1 \\ &lt;br /&gt; \\ &lt;br /&gt; 5a + 2b = 9 \\ &lt;br /&gt; b = 2 \\ &lt;br /&gt; \therefore \\ &lt;br /&gt; x = Ae^{ - 2t} + Be^{ - \tfrac{1}&lt;br /&gt; {2}t} + t + 2 \\ &lt;br /&gt; \end{gathered} $&lt;br /&gt; &lt;br /&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> That&#039;s my solution to Part A, Mathematica agrees with me when I run:<br /> <br /> <div class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--screenLimited bbCodeBlock--code"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-title"> <i class="fa--xf fal fa-code "><svg xmlns="http://www.w3.org/2000/svg" role="img" aria-hidden="true" ><use href="/data/local/icons/light.svg?v=1775307811#code"></use></svg></i> Code: </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-content" dir="ltr"> <pre class="bbCodeCode" dir="ltr" data-xf-init="code-block" data-lang=""><code>In[1]:= DSolve[ 2y&#039;&#039;[x] + 5y&#039;[x] + 2y[x] == 2x+9, y[x], x ] Out[1]= y[x] -&gt; 2 + x + e^(-x/2) * C[1] + e^(-2x) * C[2]</code></pre> </div> </div><br /> (Note y substituted for x, x substitued for t, C[1] for B, and C[2] for A.)
<br /> Okay, so that is correct (since after finding &quot;t<sub>1</sub>&quot; and &quot;t<sub>2</sub>&quot; you actually used them for &quot;m&quot;).<br /> <br /> <blockquote data-attributes="" data-quote="" data-source="" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-content"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandContent js-expandContent "> For part B, I got:<br /> <br /> &lt;br /&gt; $\begin{gathered}&lt;br /&gt; x = Ae^{ - 2t} + Be^{ - \tfrac{1}&lt;br /&gt; {2}t} + t + 2 \\ &lt;br /&gt; 3 = Ae^{ - 2\left( 0 \right)} + Be^{ - \tfrac{1}&lt;br /&gt; {2}\left( 0 \right)} + 0 + 2 \\ &lt;br /&gt; 3 = A + B + 2 \\ &lt;br /&gt; 1 = A + B \\ &lt;br /&gt; \\ &lt;br /&gt; \frac{{dx}}&lt;br /&gt; {{dt}} = - 2Ae^{ - 2t} - \tfrac{1}&lt;br /&gt; {2}Be^{ - \tfrac{1}&lt;br /&gt; {2}t} + 1 \\ &lt;br /&gt; - 1 = - 2A - \tfrac{1}&lt;br /&gt; {2}B + 1 \\ &lt;br /&gt; \\ &lt;br /&gt; A = 1 - B \\ &lt;br /&gt; - 1 = - 2\left( {1 - B} \right) - \tfrac{1}&lt;br /&gt; {2}B + 1 \\ &lt;br /&gt; 0 = B \\ &lt;br /&gt; A = 1 \\ &lt;br /&gt; \\ &lt;br /&gt; \therefore \\ &lt;br /&gt; x = e^{ - 2t} + t + 2 \\ &lt;br /&gt; \end{gathered} $&lt;br /&gt; <blockquote data-attributes="" data-quote="" data-source="" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-content"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandContent js-expandContent "> Yes, that is correct.<br /> <br /> <blockquote data-attributes="" data-quote="" data-source="" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-content"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandContent js-expandContent "> However this doesn&#039;t work with the last question (C), since the minimum of that function isn&#039;t located at ~2.84<br /> <br /> Any ideas where I&#039;ve gone wrong?<br /> <br /> Thanks! </div> </div> </blockquote> Unfortunately, you have left out the crucial calculations- why you say that doesn&#039;t work.<br /> With x= e^{-2t}+ t+ 2. dx/dt= -2e^{-2t}+ 1 and that equals 0 when e^{-2t)= 1/2 so t= ln(2)/2. Putting that into x= e^{-2t}+ t+ 2, we have x= 1/2+ ln(2)/2+ 2= 5/2+ ln(2)/2, exactly as given. </div> </div> </blockquote> </div> </div> </blockquote>
 
HallsofIvy said:
Unfortunately, you have left out the crucial calculations- why you say that doesn't work.

My apologies, the way the question uses x for the function and t for the arg threw me off and I confused the derivative with the original equations.

Thing is, the minimum point on the plot is below zero, but isn't a negative distance still a positive displacement? So the minimum points would be zero and around 0.75. So isn't the question a little wrong in this respect?

But yours (and now my) answers are in line with the answer given, so thanks.
 

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