Agnostic wars

[Loren Booda]

I predict future conflicts involving atheists against theists. Instead of religious wars, there would be "agnostic" wars. Personally, I will side with peace.

 

[FZ+]

I disagree.

The one thing about atheists as a group is that they are not a group. There is never any single cause to united them. There is never anything in particular to fight for. While a theist can always invoke the will of God to band together for a common cause, Atheists cannot band together to declare a lack of God. Most also are opposed to forcing people's opinion, and simply lack the same sense of self-righteous fervour to really last such a conflict.

Theists meanwhile are simply too fragmented to declare such a war. And there is not really much point in declaring war on atheists, since they will just pretend to worship anyway. How can you really tell if they are a real theist?

 

[BoulderHead]

I am like all other atheists only in that I do not believe there are any gods. Beyond that, I may differ dramatically in my values and beliefs from any other atheist. On both sides of the political spectrum, one can find the neo-conservative Objectivists and the ultra-liberal Communists, both of whom hate each other. These two factions take up nearly opposite sets of values, yet both are comprised of unabashed atheists. I agree with neither. Similar diversity can be found in any other group -- agnostics include devout Christians, freethinkers include New Agers, and the nonreligious include among their ranks everything from nihilists to flakes.
-- Richard C. Carrier

 

[Loren Booda]

Well-considered rebuttal. Thanks, gents.

 

[russ_watters]

Originally posted by FZ+
I disagree.

The one thing about atheists as a group is that they are not a group. There is never any single cause to united them. There is never anything in particular to fight for.

Yep. The squeaky wheel gets the grease. Athiests don't believe in anything so they have nothing to squeak about.

Of course religious people could always start the wars, but I doubt it. Religious people fight people of other religions, not people of no religion.

 

[enigma]

Originally posted by russ_watters
Religious people fight people of other religions, not people of no religion.

Unless of course you are a high school student (or younger) who let's it slip that you doubt the existence of their god.

Beatings-a-plenty from the bullies, and depending on location, varying degrees of condescension and punishment from the administrators.

Good old fashioned Christian love for you.

Of course, that isn't a war... just oppression.

Now, if the religious wrong decides that they want to go the way of George Bush, Sr. and take away the citizenship of atheists, then you'd better be sure there will be an uprising of sorts... or at very least a mass exodus of a good deal of the US's scientists who just lost their security clearances.

[/ramble]
[/rant]

 

[plus]

Originally posted by enigma
Unless of course you are a high school student (or younger) who let's it slip that you doubt the existence of their god.

Beatings-a-plenty from the bullies, and depending on location, varying degrees of condescension and punishment from the administrators.

Good old fashioned Christian love for you.

Of course, that isn't a war... just oppression.

Now, if the religious wrong decides that they want to go the way of George Bush, Sr. and take away the citizenship of atheists, then you'd better be sure there will be an uprising of sorts... or at very least a mass exodus of a good deal of the US's scientists who just lost their security clearances.

[/ramble]
[/rant]

Taking away any large group of society will harm it.

 

[russ_watters]

Really, enigma? Where exactly did you grow up (if I may ask - I live outside of Philadelphia)? My school was fairly diverse (compared with other suburban white-bread schools) and we never had any problems like that.

 

[enigma]

I grew up outside of Washington DC.

Luckily, I missed out on physical violence, though I have spoken with several people who weren't so lucky.

I wasn't as vocal then as I am now, so that may have something to do with it.

I did experience a good deal of prosthelising (sp?) and condescension though, some of it continuing up through college.

Atheists in the bible belt are worse than second class citizens to the general population.

I apologize for ranting like this. I just get riled up about religious descrimination and false persecution complexes of the religious right more and more as the years go on.

EDIT This is why I stay the heck out of the Religion forum. I just end up getting angry.

 

[Dissident Dan]

Wow, enigma, beatings for being an atheist in high school, never heard of that (how godly). I went to high school in a rather conservative area in Florida, and a some people gave me a good amount of condescension when finding out my views (I wasn't afraid to admit it, but I didn't go out proclaiming it and ringing a bell, either).

I don't know how the crap you can get punishment from the administration...sounds like a 1st amendment case to me...Although my high school did have a policy against wearing satanic stuff..which i find to be complete bullcrap.

 

[Zero]

The persecution complex of America Christians may eventually lead to violence...false victimization claims tend to galvanize that community.

 

[drag]

Originally posted by FZ+
I disagree.

The one thing about atheists as a group is that they are not a group. There is never any single cause to united them. There is never anything in particular to fight for. While a theist can always invoke the will of God to band together for a common cause, Atheists cannot band together to declare a lack of God. Most also are opposed to forcing people's opinion, and simply lack the same sense of self-righteous fervour to really last such a conflict.

Theists meanwhile are simply too fragmented to declare such a war. And there is not really much point in declaring war on atheists, since they will just pretend to worship anyway. How can you really tell if they are a real theist?

I agree with FZ+.