Calculating the force on a Crankshaft in a Steam Engine

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating the force on a crankshaft in a steam engine, focusing on the relationship between the piston force and the forces acting on the crankshaft and flywheel. Participants explore theoretical aspects, including free body diagrams and the role of torque.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that the force on the crankshaft should be equal to the force exerted by the piston, suggesting that the vertical force can be ignored due to the absence of friction.
  • Another participant proposes using a free body diagram (FBD) of the connecting rod to analyze the forces at the pins, questioning the absence of a vertical force on the piston aside from gravity and normal force.
  • A different participant expresses uncertainty about the forces at the crankshaft's other end, indicating that they know the force on the piston but are unsure how to find the corresponding force at the crankshaft.
  • One participant mentions the potential relevance of the velocity of the piston and suggests that trigonometric relationships involving the flywheel radius and the connecting rod may be useful for calculations.
  • Another participant shifts the focus to torque, arguing that torque, rather than force, is the critical quantity to consider, as it varies with the crankshaft's rotation angle.
  • A follow-up question seeks clarification on whether the lever arm refers to the length of the connecting rod or the distance from the pin on the flywheel to the flywheel's center.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on whether to focus on force or torque, indicating a lack of consensus on the primary quantity to calculate. There is also uncertainty regarding the role of vertical forces and how to approach the calculations.

Contextual Notes

Participants mention various assumptions, such as ignoring friction and the need for specific geometric relationships, but these assumptions remain unresolved. The discussion also highlights the complexity of the relationships between forces and torques in the system.

Mellorillo
Messages
3
Reaction score
0
Given that I have a steam engine, and now its size, the size of the piston, the length of its stroke and the force acting on the piston at certain points, I need to calculate the force on the crankshaft.

Now, I now that Fx should be the same where the piston meets the crank, and we can ignore Fy at this point I think, since there is no friction. But how do I calculate the force at the other end of my crank? Where the crank pushes the flywheel?

Since i don't really want people doing all the work for me I figured I needn't include variables, just some theory work from you guys would be much appreciated.

Finally, am I right in thinking i need to know the velocity of my piston, and thus my crank(Or at least the velocity of one point) I also now the RPM of the flywheel when the piston is a t top dead centre (I.e fully closed)

Hope that covers everything thanks in advance!
 
Physics news on Phys.org
Now, I now that Fx should be the same where the piston meets the crank, and we can ignore Fy at this point I think, since there is no friction. But how do I calculate the force at the other end of my crank? Where the crank pushes the flywheel?

I guess you have a pistom, connecting rod, and crankshft ( attached flywheel).
Perhaps you should do a fbd of the connecting rod to determine your forces at your pins, knowing that with a pin connection the force will be along the centrerline of the member ( or from centre of one pin to the other ), Is there really no y-force?
 
Done a free body.
I can't think of what the y force would be? there should be none on the piston (other than gravity and some force N pushing up on the piston but since there is no friction i ignore these right?)
Though there will be an x and y component of the forces on the pin at the other end of the crankshaft where it meets the fly wheel.
Finding these forces is proving to be a problem.

I know the force on the piston at a point B as the steam expands. (Pressure*pistonArea - ambientPressure*piston diameter) so that should also be my Fx where the piston meets the rod, but how then do I go about finding the force at the other end of the rod? Does finding the velocity help?

I think a friend mentioned finding an equation X in theta (where theta is the angle of the flywheel out of the 360 degrees in a revolution) but I am unsure how to do that, Trigonometry using the flywheel radius and the rod maybe?

Thanks for your time
 
I would think the germane question is what is the torque, not the force, on the crankshaft.

The force is just the force of the piston. The torque is that force times the lever-arm imparting torque to the crankshaft. That torque is of course time-varying with the rotation angle of the crankshaft.
 
The torque you reckon? Which is the force translated to the fly wheel?
By lever arm do you mean the rod length? or the distance from the pin on the fly wheel to the fly wheel centre?
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 32 ·
2
Replies
32
Views
8K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
3K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 49 ·
2
Replies
49
Views
5K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
1K
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
3K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
2K