Can Anything Move Beyond the Speed of Light?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of whether anything can move beyond the speed of light, particularly in the context of relativity. Participants explore the implications of measuring the speed of light and question the constancy of this speed under different conditions or environments.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that if forces acting on us, such as gravity, were removed, it might be possible for something to exceed the speed of light, questioning the limits imposed by our perception.
  • Another participant challenges the notion that the speed of light is merely a limit of perception, emphasizing that it can be measured accurately in controlled environments.
  • Further clarification is provided regarding the measurement of light speed, with an example of using a laser and mirror in a lab setting to demonstrate that speed can be measured without needing to "run along" with the light.
  • Concerns are raised about the ability to measure the speed of light as a constant across the universe, suggesting that our current methods may not account for all possible environments.
  • One participant argues that the speed of light is a constant of nature that has not been disproven, while another points out that measurements can vary based on location, as indicated by general relativity.
  • There is a discussion about how light speed is measured using detectors and radio antennas, not solely relying on human perception.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the constancy of the speed of light and the implications of measuring it. There is no consensus on whether something can exceed the speed of light, and the discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight limitations in measuring the speed of light based on environmental factors and the assumptions underlying current measurement techniques. There is an acknowledgment of the complexity involved in understanding light speed in different contexts.

wishiwassmart
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I might be in the wrong section for this; however, I have been reading about relativity and I am left with a question. The speed of light is deemed as constant but it is at the limits of our perceptions or senses. Is it not possible, that something in fact can move beyond the speed of light, if it is free of similar trappings that are imposed upon us. For example, if it were possible to remove forces that act upon us locally, such as the gravity of our sun, solar system, nearby stars, even galaxy, would this shift the perception of c?
Sorry if this is confusing, at the moment its the best way I have of expressing this thought...
 
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wishiwassmart said:
The speed of light is deemed as constant but it is at the limits of our perceptions or senses.
Why do you think this? We can measure the speed of light.
 
Again: welcome to physicsforums! :smile:

And to elaborate: we can in a lab, point a laser at a mirror and measure the time for the laser pulse to return next to the point of emission. With the old definitions, the speed of light is the total distance divided by the time.

In that light (pun not intended), perhaps you can re-phrase your question.
 
Doc Al said:
Why do you think this? We can measure the speed of light.
The speed of light is regarded as, judged as, or considered as constant. Light is part of our perception of everything we can observe. In sight, light is used to see. The speed of light is the fastest known speed, therefore it is at our limits of our perceptions/senses. I never stated that it was beyond our limits. I apologize I thought that part was clearly stated. I will attempt to clarify the rest of the question, which brings context to that statement.

I am questioning our ability to measure it as constant for the universe and also our ability to measure it as the fastest speed. If we use light to measure it and measure it in the same environment that we exist in, how do we know it this will hold true if it is measured and observed in an environment free of some or most of the limitations that act upon our environment? - This mainly questions constant. Is it possible that something can move faster than the speed of light, but we simply lack the means to observe it at this time? -this is the question related to light being at the limit of our perception senses. For example, how would we measure the speed of light, or even know to, if we did not have eyes?
 
harrylin said:
Again: welcome to physicsforums! :smile:

And to elaborate: we can in a lab, point a laser at a mirror and measure the time for the laser pulse to return next to the point of emission. With the old definitions, the speed of light is the total distance divided by the time.

In that light (pun not intended), perhaps you can re-phrase your question.
Thank you :)

I hope my reply to Doc helps.
 
wishiwassmart said:
The speed of light is regarded as, judged as, or considered as constant. Light is part of our perception of everything we can observe. In sight, light is used to see. The speed of light is the fastest known speed, therefore it is at our limits of our perceptions/senses.
Not really. The measurement that I sketched can be performed in a university room. The point is that we don't need to "run along" with something in order to measure its speed. We can just sit and watch like spectators who watch a car race.
[..] I am questioning our ability to measure it as constant for the universe
Another misunderstanding: we simply measure the speed. According to theory, the speed of light corresponds to a constant of nature. The theory has not been disproved.
and also our ability to measure it as the fastest speed. If we use light to measure it
In order to measure the speed of a car, one should measure the speed of a car - right?
and measure it in the same environment that we exist in, how do we know it this will hold true if it is measured and observed in an environment free of some or most of the limitations that act upon our environment?
That can be done for example by means of interplanetary measurements. According to the general theory of relativity, the speed of light isn't the exactly the same non-locally, just as you seem to suggest. And this was confirmed by measurements.
[..] how would we measure the speed of light, or even know to, if we did not have eyes?
We measure the speed of light with light detectors as well as with radio antennas. Light is a form of radio wave.

Did that help?
 

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