Can you explain the basics of Newton's law?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the basics of Newton's laws, particularly focusing on the mathematical formulation of motion in one dimension. Participants explore the relationship between force, potential energy, and kinetic energy, while also addressing some personal reflections on memory and understanding of the concepts.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Meta-discussion

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion about the equation relating kinetic energy and potential energy, specifically questioning the presence of the factor of 1/2 and the interpretation of velocity in the context of the equation.
  • Another participant attempts to clarify the derivation of the kinetic energy formula using calculus, but the explanation remains complex and may not fully address the original confusion.
  • Several participants engage in a side discussion about the meaning of a German adage, "standing on a garden hose," which is used to describe a moment of forgetfulness or a mental block.
  • Another participant offers a different German phrase, "going down the wooden track," which refers to having a wrong idea or making incorrect assumptions, contrasting it with the garden hose metaphor.
  • A participant relates the garden hose metaphor to the English phrase "lost my train of thought," suggesting a shared experience of temporary forgetfulness.
  • A further contribution mentions a similar saying from Norway, "having an iron curtain," which refers to a mental block, drawing a cultural parallel.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the meanings of the metaphors discussed, but there is no consensus on the initial mathematical confusion regarding Newton's laws. The technical aspects remain unresolved, with differing interpretations and explanations offered.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes various assumptions about the mathematical relationships involved in Newton's laws, and the explanations provided may depend on participants' differing levels of familiarity with calculus and physics concepts.

Who May Find This Useful

Individuals interested in the foundational concepts of Newtonian mechanics, as well as those exploring the nuances of language and cultural expressions related to forgetfulness and understanding.

Herbststurm
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Hello

Maybe I am standing on a garden hose (great German adage, does it exist in english or are you confused what I am talking about?)

Okay, to the topic:
Just for one dimension. It is easier:

We have m\ddot{x} = F(x(t)) Now my book tells me that if I expansion with the velocity I should get:

\frac{m}{2} \frac{d}{dt} \dot{x}^{2} = - \frac{d}{dt} U(x(t))

I don't understand. Sadly I learnet it a year ago and I forgot everything. How sad a fate! :-(

I understand the right-hand side. Force is the derivative of the potential, the field must be conservative. But I don't understand the left-hand side.

1.) why is there a two under the mass?

2.) I expansion with the velocity? the differentialoperator on the velocity is my acceleration and the second velocity is one from the expansion. Where is the second? I could only identify one velocity. What happened?

Thanks
greetings
 
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v=dx/dt; dv/dt=d2x/dt2

d(v2)/dt
=[d(v2)/dv][dv/dt]
=[2v][dv/dt]
=[2dx/dt][dv/dt]

Rearrange using first and last lines of the above:
dv/dt=[d(v2)/dt][dt/dx]/2

LHS: m[dv/dt]=m[d(v2)/dt][dt/dx]/2

RHS: F=-dU/dx=-[dU/dt][dt/dx]

LHS=RHS
m[d(v2)/dt][dt/dx]/2=-[dU/dt][dt/dx]
m[d(v2)/dt]/2=-[dU/dt]
 
Herbststurm said:
Maybe I am standing on a garden hose (great German adage, does it exist in english or are you confused what I am talking about?)
I work with a lot of Germans, so I would really like to know what "standing on a garden hose" means.
 
w = \int \vec{F} ~ d\vec{r} = m ~ \int \vec{a} ~ d\vec{r}

\vec{a} = \frac{d \vec{v}}{dt} = \frac{d \vec{v}}{dt} \frac{d \vec{r}}{d\vec{r}} = \frac{d \vec{v}}{dr} \frac{d \vec{r}}{dt} = \frac{d \vec{v}}{dr} \vec{v}

\Rightarrow w = m ~ \int \frac{d \vec{v}}{dr} \vec{v} ~ d\vec{r} = m ~ \int d \vec{v} ~ \vec{v} = m \frac{v^{2}}{2} = \frac{1}{2} m v^{2}

Okay, I got it again :)

Damn, it is bad how fast on is able to forgot things :eek:

DaleSpam said:
I work with a lot of Germans, so I would really like to know what "standing on a garden hose" means.

It means that on has a huge black out. If you know something in general but you forgot it in this moment. Than you are standing on a garden hose.

greetings
 
Herbststurm said:
Hello

Maybe I am standing on a garden hose (great German adage, does it exist in english or are you confused what I am talking about?)

Is that similar to going down the wooden track (auf dem holzen Bahn oder etwas? Es is eine lange Zeit sinds ich deutsch geschrieben habe)
 
redargon said:
Is that similar to going down the wooden track (auf dem holzen Bahn oder etwas? Es is eine lange Zeit sinds ich deutsch geschrieben habe)

Hi,

no it is not similar. What you mean is "Sich auf dem Holzweg befinden". This means that somebody has a idea but the idea is wrong. If you do wrong calculations or assumptions than you are going down the wooden track.
The garden hose means black out, not wrong ideas.

greetings
 
Herbststurm said:
It means that on has a huge black out. If you know something in general but you forgot it in this moment. Than you are standing on a garden hose.
That makes sense, so the idea is somewhere backed up in the garden hose, but since you are standing on it the idea won't come out.

I think we would say "I lost my train of thought" meaning the thought is there on the tracks somewhere, and you just cannot find it right now.
 
In Norway, that saying is equivalent to saying that you're having an "iron curtain". Dunno if this is used in other countries as well, but it refers to the information block in Europe during the cold war.
 

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