Circus Performer Falling into a Safety Net

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    Falling Net Safety
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the mechanics of a circus performer falling into a safety net, specifically examining whether this scenario can be explained through the lens of inelastic collisions. Participants explore the nature of the collision, the effects of gravity, and the properties of the net material.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that the collision is perfectly inelastic because the performer and the net move together post-collision, suggesting that kinetic energy is transferred from the performer to the net.
  • Others argue that gravity plays a crucial role, stating that without it, the performer would bounce back, indicating that the collision cannot be classified as inelastic under those conditions.
  • One participant suggests that trapeze nets are semi-elastic, allowing for some bounce, which may depend on the tension and material used in the net.
  • There is a discussion about the definition of elastic versus inelastic collisions, with some participants noting that a perfectly elastic collision would conserve kinetic energy, while inelastic collisions involve energy dissipation.
  • Some participants express uncertainty about what constitutes a perfectly inelastic collision, questioning whether the repeated bouncing could be considered a single inelastic event.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on whether the collision can be classified as perfectly inelastic. Multiple competing views remain regarding the effects of gravity and the nature of the net.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the discussion regarding the assumptions made about the forces acting on the performer and the net, as well as the definitions of collision types. The discussion also reflects uncertainty about the classification of the collision as perfectly inelastic.

kd001
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Can this be explained in terms of inelastic collisions? This is what I think:

The collision is perfectly inelastic because the person and the net move together with the same velocity. This means that the initial kinetic energy of the system (and therefore the kinetic energy of the person) is reduced. Basically the safety net acts by transferring kinetic energy from the person to the net.

Do you think this is a valid argument?

Thanks
 
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kd001 said:
Can this be explained in terms of inelastic collisions? This is what I think:

Not really. Without gravity a Performer hitting the net would be shoot back again. That would be pretty elastic. On Earth gravity forces him to stay in the Net, just like a bouncing ball stays on the ground after some jumps. This doesn't make the ball/ground collision inelastic.

Usually when considering elastic vs. inelastic collisions you don't have any forces from outside acting on the bodies.
 
Trapeze nets are semi-elastic. Like an inefficient trampolene. The peformers can sometimes bounce back up quite aways, but this may be adjustable via tension, or it's a different, more elastic material used for those acts where the peformers bounce back up again. Note that the competition trampolines are also net like (Austrilian or Ozzie bed), unlike the canvas strap ones we're used to seeing, or the outdoor black mesh ones.
 
A.T. said:
Not really. Without gravity a Performer hitting the net would be shoot back again. That would be pretty elastic. On Earth gravity forces him to stay in the Net, just like a bouncing ball stays on the ground after some jumps. This doesn't make the ball/ground collision inelastic.

Actually, it does! If the collision were perfectly elastic, the performer (or the bouncing ball) would jump up exactly as high as the height it originally fell from (conservation of energy). Only because there is dissipation (heat), the rebounce is not as high. But that's exactly what it means, an inelastic collision: that there is dissipation.
 
vanesch said:
Actually, it does! If the collision were perfectly elastic,
Yeah, I meant: "This doesn't make the ball/ground collision perfectly inelastic." which is what the OP was asking about.

But if you consdider the whole bouncing less & less process as one collision, you could call it perfectly inelastic.
 
A.T. said:
Yeah, I meant: "This doesn't make the ball/ground collision perfectly inelastic."

:biggrin: I think you're digging yourself in a hole.

I don't know what would be a perfectly inelastic collision, honestly...

An elastic collision is a collision where the sum of kinetic energies before and after collision is conserved. An inelastic collision is one which is not elastic, that is, where this sum is not conserved (most of the time, the sum is less after than before though not always).

So a perfectly inelastic collision is ... (?)
 

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