Classical Ideal Gas: Pathria's Insight on Non-Interacting Particles

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the interpretation of a statement from Pathria's book regarding non-interacting particles in an ideal gas. Participants explore the implications of negligible mutual interactions and the significance of wave packet overlap in the context of classical and quantum statistics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants seek clarification on the statement regarding wave packets and spatial correlations among non-interacting particles.
  • One participant suggests that the second statement implies particles do not have a moment of inertia, which would prevent them from acquiring internal energy.
  • Another participant argues that the statement indicates the gas is not degenerate, thus classical statistics are applicable.
  • A different viewpoint posits that the second statement suggests a low probability of finding particles in the same location, indicating minimal overlap of wavefunctions.
  • One participant elaborates that overlapping wavefunctions do not necessarily imply proximity of particles, using plane waves as an example, and discusses the conditions under which classical statistics apply.
  • Mathematical expressions related to Fermi-Dirac and Bose-Einstein distributions are presented to illustrate the transition to Maxwell-Boltzmann statistics under certain conditions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing interpretations of the implications of wave packet overlap and the conditions under which classical statistics apply. No consensus is reached on the precise meaning of the statements from Pathria's book.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference specific mathematical conditions and statistical distributions without resolving the underlying assumptions or implications related to the overlap of wavefunctions and the applicability of classical versus quantum statistics.

rbwang1225
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In the book of Pathria(p.16), he mentioned that If (i) the mutual interactions among particles are negligible and (ii) the wave packets of individual particles do not significantly overlap, then there does not exist any spatial correlations among the particles in the system composed of non-interacting particles.

I don't really understand the second statement.

Can anyone interpret it more clearly? Thanks in advance.
 
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rbwang1225 said:
In the book of Pathria(p.16), he mentioned that If (i) the mutual interactions among particles are negligible and (ii) the wave packets of individual particles do not significantly overlap, then there does not exist any spatial correlations among the particles in the system composed of non-interacting particles.

I don't really understand the second statement.

Can anyone interpret it more clearly? Thanks in advance.
I could be wrong but I think it is a fancy way of saying that the particles do not have a moment of inertia. This would mean that the particles cannot acquire internal energy. Perhaps others will comment.

AM
 
No, the second statement means that the gas is not degenerate so that you have to apply quantum statistics and the classical statistics works well.
 
In my own point of view, I think the 2nd statement is saying that the probability of finding the particles at the same place is small, which is to say the wavefunctions do not overlap significantly. But I am not sure, can anybody comment on it more clearly?
 
Wave functions overlapping does not necessarily mean that they are at the same position. Consider plane waves. They would overlap if their wave vectors have approximately equal values, which would mean that their momenta are approximately the same. But, a plane wave is extended throughout the whole volume, so you cannot say the particles are nearby.

You should not ascribe too much weight to their 'condition'. It simply comes from the math. Namely, consider Fermi-Dirac or Bose-Einstein distribution:

[tex] \overline{n}_{i} = \frac{1}{\exp\left(\frac{\varepsilon_{i} - \mu}{T}\right) \pm 1}[/tex]

They would both reduce to the Maxwell-Boltzmann distribution:

[tex] \overline{n}_{i} = \exp\left(\frac{\mu - \varepsilon_{i}}{T}\right)[/tex]

when:

[tex] \exp\left(\frac{\varepsilon_{i} - \mu}{T}\right) \gg 1[/tex]

The left hand side is a monotonically increasing function of energy. So, it has a lower bound for the lowest possible energy of the particles. We may take this to be zero. Then, we still have to satisfy the condition:

[tex] \exp\left(-\frac{\mu}{T}\right) \gg 1 \Leftrightarrow \exp\left(\frac{\mu}{T}\right) \ll 1[/tex]

The chemical potential needs to be negative and equal several times the temperature by magnitude for this inequality to be satisfied (because of the exponential). The chemical potential is fixed essentially by the density of particles. Let us evaluate it for a free ideal gas under the Maxwell-Boltzmann distribution: Then, the plane waves are energy eigenstates:

[tex] N = \sum_{i}{\overline{n}_{i}} = \sum_{\mathbf{k}}{\exp\left(\frac{\mu - \varepsilon_{k}}{T}\right)}[/tex]

[tex] N = \exp\left(\frac{\mu}{T}\right) \, \sum_{\mathbf{k}}{\exp\left(-\frac{\hbar^{2} k^{2}}{2 m T}\right)}[/tex]

Going over from summation to integration with respect to [itex]\mathbf{k}[/itex] according to the well-known rule:

[tex] \sum_{\mathbf{k}}{f_{\mathbf{k}}} = V \, \int{\frac{d^{3} k}{(2\pi)^{3}} f(\mathbf{k})}[/tex]

we get:

[tex] N = V \, \exp\left(\frac{\mu}{T}\right) \, \frac{4\pi}{(2\pi)^{3}} \, \int_{0}^{\infty}{k^{2} \, \exp\left(-\frac{\hbar^{2} k^{2}}{2 m T}\right) \, dk}[/tex]

The integral can be made dimensionless by introducing:

[tex] x \equiv \frac{\hbar^{2} k^{2}}{2 m T} \Rightarrow k = \frac{(2 m T x)^{\frac{1}{2}}}{\hbar}, \; dx = \frac{(2 m T)^{\frac{1}{2}} \, x^{-\frac{1}{2}}}{2 \hbar} \. dx[/tex]

[tex] N = V \, \exp\left(\frac{\mu}{T}\right) \, \frac{1}{2\pi^{2}} \, \frac{(2 m T)^{\frac{3}{2}}}{2 \hbar^{3}} \, \int_{0}^{\infty}{x^{\frac{1}{2}} \, e^{-x} \, dx}[/tex]

The value of the integral is [itex]\Gamma(\frac{3}{2}) = \pi^{1/2}/2[/tex] and we can identify [itex]n \equiv N/V[/itex]. Then, we get for the chemical potential:<br /> <br /> [tex] \exp\left(\frac{\mu}{T}\right) = n \, \left(\frac{2 \pi \hbar^{2}}{m T}\right)^{\frac{3}{2}} \ll 1[/tex]<br /> <br /> We identify:<br /> <br /> [tex] \lambda_{T} = \left(\frac{2 \pi \hbar^{2}}{m T}\right)^{\frac{1}{2}} = \frac{h}{\sqrt{2 \pi m T}}[/tex]<br /> <br /> as the <i>thermal De Broglie wavelength</i> and [itex]r = n^{-1/3}[/tex] as the average interparticle distance. Then, the above condition can be written as:<br /> <br /> [tex] \exp\left(\frac{\mu}{T}\right) = \left(\frac{\lambda_{T}}{r}\right)^{3} \ll 1 \Leftrightarrow \lambda_{T} \ll r[/tex]<br /> <br /> , i.e. we can use classical statistics (the gas is non-degenerate) if the thermal De Broglie wavelength is much smaller than the average inter particle distance. I guess this is why they interpret it as their wavefunctions (whose wavelengths are of the order of [itex]\lambda_{T}[/itex]) should not 'overlap'.[/itex][/itex]
 
Last edited:
\overline{n}_{i} = \frac{1}{\exp\left(\frac{\varepsilon_{i} - \mu}{T}\right) \pm 1}
 

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