Arranging Identical Chips in a Circle: Combinatorics Question Explained

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The discussion centers on calculating the number of ways to arrange four identical red chips and two identical white chips in a circle. Initially, the linear arrangement yields 15 combinations, but the challenge arises when considering circular permutations, leading to confusion about how to account for identical arrangements. It is noted that not all circular arrangements produce unique linear sequences due to symmetry, complicating the division by the number of positions. The conclusion reached is that there are only three distinct arrangements when considering the circular nature of the problem. Overall, the complexity of circular arrangements compared to linear ones is emphasized, highlighting the need for a tailored approach to solve such combinatorial questions.
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Homework Statement


In how many ways can four identical red chips and two identical white chips be arranged in a circle?

Homework Equations

The Attempt at a Solution


First, I calculated the number of different arrangements when the the chips are just in a line. This is ##\displaystyle {6 \choose 2} = 15##. Next, I thought that since the chips are arranged in a circle, we have to divide by 6 to take into account the rotations that would essentially be considered the same. However, 15 is obviously not divisible by 6, so I am doing something wrong. What am I doing wrong?
 
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Mr Davis 97 said:

Homework Statement


In how many ways can four identical red chips and two identical white chips be arranged in a circle?

Homework Equations

The Attempt at a Solution


First, I calculated the number of different arrangements when the the chips are just in a line. This is ##\displaystyle {6 \choose 2} = 15##. Next, I thought that since the chips are arranged in a circle, we have to divide by 6 to take into account the rotations that would essentially be considered the same. However, 15 is obviously not divisible by 6, so I am doing something wrong. What am I doing wrong?
Not all circles of 6 will produce 6 different linear sequences by starting at the 6 different points.
In general, you would also need to consider whether two circles that are mirror images should be counted as one or two, but in this very simple set up I don't think that arises.
 
haruspex said:
Not all circles of 6 will produce 6 different linear sequences by starting at the 6 different points.
In general, you would also need to consider whether two circles that are mirror images should be counted as one or two, but in this very simple set up I don't think that arises.
I looked at the problem a bit more and realized that there are only 3 arrangements, so this solves the problem. However, I still want to see how this is done with numbers. I'm not sure what you mean by the first part of your post. Do I need to rethink my initial approach, or do I need to somehow divide by 3 to get the correct answer?
 
Mr Davis 97 said:
I looked at the problem a bit more and realized that there are only 3 arrangements, so this solves the problem. However, I still want to see how this is done with numbers. I'm not sure what you mean by the first part of your post. Do I need to rethink my initial approach, or do I need to somehow divide by 3 to get the correct answer?
There is no simple ratio that can be justified between the linear and circular counts.
If we start with the circle (RRWWWW) and generate linear sequences by taking the 6 possible starting points in it, we get 6 different sequences. Similarly with (RWRWWW).
If we start with the circle (RWWRWW), we only get three different linear sequences.
6+6+3=15.
 
I tried to combine those 2 formulas but it didn't work. I tried using another case where there are 2 red balls and 2 blue balls only so when combining the formula I got ##\frac{(4-1)!}{2!2!}=\frac{3}{2}## which does not make sense. Is there any formula to calculate cyclic permutation of identical objects or I have to do it by listing all the possibilities? Thanks
Since ##px^9+q## is the factor, then ##x^9=\frac{-q}{p}## will be one of the roots. Let ##f(x)=27x^{18}+bx^9+70##, then: $$27\left(\frac{-q}{p}\right)^2+b\left(\frac{-q}{p}\right)+70=0$$ $$b=27 \frac{q}{p}+70 \frac{p}{q}$$ $$b=\frac{27q^2+70p^2}{pq}$$ From this expression, it looks like there is no greatest value of ##b## because increasing the value of ##p## and ##q## will also increase the value of ##b##. How to find the greatest value of ##b##? Thanks
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