Combining Equations to Get dCm/dt

  • Thread starter Thread starter squenshl
  • Start date Start date
Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the mathematical modeling of cell proliferation, specifically focusing on the combination of equations related to probabilities and area exclusions to derive a first-order ordinary differential equation (ODE) for the rate of change of cell density, dCm/dt. The context involves recurrence relations and probability functions in a biological setting.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Mathematical reasoning, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the relationship between the probability of successful cell proliferation and the recurrence relations for excluded areas. There are attempts to understand how to transition from a recurrence equation to a first-order ODE. Questions are raised about the derivation of specific terms in the equations, such as the origin of the 2d^2 term and the role of lambda in the context of the limit involving Pp and tau.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants expressing confusion about specific aspects of the equations and their derivations. Some have referenced external materials for clarification, but there is no clear consensus or resolution yet.

Contextual Notes

Participants note challenges in understanding the mathematical relationships and assumptions underlying the equations, particularly in the context of limits and the transition from discrete to continuous models.

squenshl
Messages
468
Reaction score
4

Homework Statement


Given that we have the equation pi which is the probability that the centre of cell i is not in A (i and A not is not important), given that cells 1 to i-1 are not in A, then we have
$$
p_i = \frac{1-E_{i-1}-A}{1-E_{i-1}},
$$
where Ei is the proportion of the total area excluded by the first i cells. The probability Ps that a proliferation attempt will be successful is then the probability that the centres of all N(t) cells lie outside A,
$$
P_s = \prod_{i=1}^{N(t)-1} \frac{1-E_i-A}{1-E_i}.
$$
Each agent excludes an area $$\pi\Delta^2$$ although the area excluded by different agents can overlap. Hence, we may write a recurrence relation for Ei as
$$
E_{i+1} = E_i+\pi d^2\left(1-q_i\right),
$$
where
$$
d = \frac{\Delta}{\Omega}
$$
and qi is the expected proportion of cells i's excluded area that overlaps with the area already excluded by the first i-1 cells. After some work we get the recurrence relation
$$
E_i = 1-\left(1-\pi d^2\right)^i.
$$
Provided that the domain size is large
$$
\left(d<<1\right),
$$
we can treat the spatially averaged agent density as a continuous variable. Combining equations Ps, Ei+1 and Ei gives
$$
\frac{dC_m}{dt} = \lambda C_m\prod_{i=1}^{c_m/d^2-1}\frac{\left(1-\pi d^2\right)^i-2d^2}{\left(1-\pi d^2\right)^i},
$$
where
$$
\lambda = \lim_{\tau \to 0} \left(P_p/\tau\right).
$$
and Pp is the probability the a cell attempts to proliferate. My question is how do we combine equations Ps, Ei+1 and Ei to get dCm/dt. In other words, how do we go from a difference/recurrence equation to a first order ODE. I have never come across this before.

Homework Equations





The Attempt at a Solution


I tried a Taylor series but no luck. Someone please help.
 
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
squenshl said:
$$
\lambda = \lim_{\tau \to 0} \left(P_p/\tau\right).
$$
Where does this come from? I don't understand the relation between ##P_p## and ##\tau## in the limit.
 
See page 4 of the attached file for the limit and page 6 for the proof.
 

Attachments

Still struggling on how to get equation 3.9. I just don't know where the 2d^2 term and the lambdaC_m come from. I know where everything does.
 
I guess no one knows how to do this too :(
 
Still got nothing.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 105 ·
4
Replies
105
Views
11K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
3K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K
  • · Replies 16 ·
Replies
16
Views
2K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
3K
Replies
4
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 22 ·
Replies
22
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
1K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K